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Author Topic: Cornerbacks... who do you like?  (Read 2141 times)

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Offline WTX_Cheese

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Cornerbacks... who do you like?
« on: April 02, 2018, 10:55:35 AM »
I've been watching game video of corners, especially the top 5-6 or so. Anybody really stick out to you guys?

I really like Isaiah Oliver (Colorado), maybe almost as much as the "top" guys like Jackson and Ward. He really excels in press coverage but a little slow to react in off coverage.

Who do you guys like? Early, Mid or Late?

Offline Participant

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Re: Cornerbacks... who do you like?
« Reply #1 on: April 02, 2018, 07:24:16 PM »
From what I've read and seen, They could make a case for any of the top five. Who will be the best and worst in the pros would only be an opinion at this point. However, there may be someone in the second round at CB if they choose to go with BPA at #14 that isn't a CB. I see some mocks that has Fitzpatrick falling to #14...but he better be able to play corner at that spot.

Offline dannobanano

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Re: Cornerbacks... who do you like?
« Reply #2 on: April 03, 2018, 06:32:03 AM »
From what I've read and seen, They could make a case for any of the top five. Who will be the best and worst in the pros would only be an opinion at this point. However, there may be someone in the second round at CB if they choose to go with BPA at #14 that isn't a CB. I see some mocks that has Fitzpatrick falling to #14...but he better be able to play corner at that spot.

WR could be in play in round 2, but if they go CB, I (personally) like Carlton Davis. He's big, and his press-man coverage is outstanding.

Offline RT

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Re: Cornerbacks... who do you like?
« Reply #3 on: April 03, 2018, 08:56:33 AM »
I've been watching game video of corners, especially the top 5-6 or so. Anybody really stick out to you guys?

I really like Isaiah Oliver (Colorado), maybe almost as much as the "top" guys like Jackson and Ward. He really excels in press coverage but a little slow to react in off coverage.

Who do you guys like? Early, Mid or Late?

Isaiah Oliver checks all the boxes in what the Packers historically look for in a CB. Their is a very strong likelihood that he is on their big board.

His pro-day numbers. Cornerback Isaiah Oliver sat on his 40 time from the combine but participated in the rest of the testing, touching 35.5 inches in the vertical jump, 10-foot-6 in the broad jump, 3.94 in the short shuttle and 6.85 in the three-cone.

Other CB's who meet their benchmarks are Josh Jackson, like Oliver is projected as a 1-2 round pick.

Nick Nelson, Isaac Yiadom, Holton Hill, Tony Brown, J.C. Jackson are all qualifiers who project as mid-round picks (3-5).

Andre Chachere and Dmontre Wade are a couple of late round (6-7) guys who are qualifiers.

The news that the Packers are bring Mike Hughes in for a visit is interesting to me. The last time they draft a corner that short was Ahmad Carroll. Could they really be thinking of him at 14? Or do they think he is there at 45? Most are projecting him 25-40, interested to see how this plays out.   

Offline dannobanano

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Re: Cornerbacks... who do you like?
« Reply #4 on: April 03, 2018, 09:17:28 AM »
I find myself wondering if the Packers are going to continue to use the same CB criteria that they have used during the Ted Thompson era, or are they going to make adjustments to that criteria to maybe better fit what Pettine wants in boundary CB's.

Pettine might view Hughes as a slot defender, rather than a boundary defender.

JMHO

Offline RT

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Re: Cornerbacks... who do you like?
« Reply #5 on: April 03, 2018, 09:47:24 AM »
I find myself wondering if the Packers are going to continue to use the same CB criteria that they have used during the Ted Thompson era, or are they going to make adjustments to that criteria to maybe better fit what Pettine wants in boundary CB's.

Pettine might view Hughes as a slot defender, rather than a boundary defender.

JMHO

I thought the samething about the possiblity that they may well have tweaked the criteria from the past, but these benchmarks go back to Ron Wolf. It is not just a TT thing. As for Pettine having any influence into changing player types that are drafted, I would need proof of that. I know fans think he has come to save the day and he is wielding power to do whatever he wants, but I think his input on who is drafted is just slightly more than zero percent. 

Offline Shinesman

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Re: Cornerbacks... who do you like?
« Reply #6 on: April 03, 2018, 02:33:22 PM »
I find myself wondering if the Packers are going to continue to use the same CB criteria that they have used during the Ted Thompson era, or are they going to make adjustments to that criteria to maybe better fit what Pettine wants in boundary CB's.

Pettine might view Hughes as a slot defender, rather than a boundary defender.

JMHO

I thought the samething about the possiblity that they may well have tweaked the criteria from the past, but these benchmarks go back to Ron Wolf. It is not just a TT thing. As for Pettine having any influence into changing player types that are drafted, I would need proof of that. I know fans think he has come to save the day and he is wielding power to do whatever he wants, but I think his input on who is drafted is just slightly more than zero percent.

Then why would they hire a guy to fix this defense if he has no say in the players that get picked for it? I think too many fans here are in some variant of Stockholm syndrome from the TT era. It was very clear TT didn't give a damn what coaches wanted or take the input of his personnel team very highly. Thus the exodus of execs and the frustration of players and coaches. Most teams let their coaches have an input because it's a team effort, that includes coaches. Coaches are the subject matter experts of the game being played on the field. To downplay them is sad and I think the new power structure was created to avoid such a scenario.
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Offline Fargofootball

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Re: Cornerbacks... who do you like?
« Reply #7 on: April 03, 2018, 03:26:40 PM »
No ball hawks in the backfield today, so I'd go with Jackson.

 I think he will be as good as Marcus Peters without the headaches.

Would really like to see a trade up into late 1 or early 2 to pick him up. Had some 4.4 times at the Iowa pro day but fastest official was 4.52 and 4.54.

Won't be any real help for the pass rush if we wait after our 1st pick and likely won't see that kind of player in the next few drafts, knock on wood.






Offline WTX_Cheese

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Re: Cornerbacks... who do you like?
« Reply #8 on: April 03, 2018, 03:47:01 PM »
I've been watching game video of corners, especially the top 5-6 or so. Anybody really stick out to you guys?

I really like Isaiah Oliver (Colorado), maybe almost as much as the "top" guys like Jackson and Ward. He really excels in press coverage but a little slow to react in off coverage.

Who do you guys like? Early, Mid or Late?

Isaiah Oliver checks all the boxes in what the Packers historically look for in a CB. Their is a very strong likelihood that he is on their big board.

His pro-day numbers. Cornerback Isaiah Oliver sat on his 40 time from the combine but participated in the rest of the testing, touching 35.5 inches in the vertical jump, 10-foot-6 in the broad jump, 3.94 in the short shuttle and 6.85 in the three-cone.

Other CB's who meet their benchmarks are Josh Jackson, like Oliver is projected as a 1-2 round pick.

Nick Nelson, Isaac Yiadom, Holton Hill, Tony Brown, J.C. Jackson are all qualifiers who project as mid-round picks (3-5).

Andre Chachere and Dmontre Wade are a couple of late round (6-7) guys who are qualifiers.

The news that the Packers are bring Mike Hughes in for a visit is interesting to me. The last time they draft a corner that short was Ahmad Carroll. Could they really be thinking of him at 14? Or do they think he is there at 45? Most are projecting him 25-40, interested to see how this plays out.

THANK YOU, RT. This is the exact type of info/discussion I was looking for. I generally know the size/speed minimums that they seem to hold over from the Wolf era, but it's hard to get a comprehensive list of these types of guys.

Any personal favorites on your end?

Offline WTX_Cheese

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Re: Cornerbacks... who do you like?
« Reply #9 on: April 03, 2018, 03:55:09 PM »
No ball hawks in the backfield today, so I'd go with Jackson.

 I think he will be as good as Marcus Peters without the headaches.

Would really like to see a trade up into late 1 or early 2 to pick him up. Had some 4.4 times at the Iowa pro day but fastest official was 4.52 and 4.54.

Won't be any real help for the pass rush if we wait after our 1st pick and likely won't see that kind of player in the next few drafts, knock on wood.

I went back and forth on Jackson for a while, but he's pretty high on my Packers "Wish List". I don't think he drops out of Round 1, but I just feel like some Pass Rush help is a little more pressing. (Landry!)

Offline RT

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Re: Cornerbacks... who do you like?
« Reply #10 on: April 03, 2018, 04:35:26 PM »
I've been watching game video of corners, especially the top 5-6 or so. Anybody really stick out to you guys?

I really like Isaiah Oliver (Colorado), maybe almost as much as the "top" guys like Jackson and Ward. He really excels in press coverage but a little slow to react in off coverage.

Who do you guys like? Early, Mid or Late?

Isaiah Oliver checks all the boxes in what the Packers historically look for in a CB. Their is a very strong likelihood that he is on their big board.

His pro-day numbers. Cornerback Isaiah Oliver sat on his 40 time from the combine but participated in the rest of the testing, touching 35.5 inches in the vertical jump, 10-foot-6 in the broad jump, 3.94 in the short shuttle and 6.85 in the three-cone.

Other CB's who meet their benchmarks are Josh Jackson, like Oliver is projected as a 1-2 round pick.

Nick Nelson, Isaac Yiadom, Holton Hill, Tony Brown, J.C. Jackson are all qualifiers who project as mid-round picks (3-5).

Andre Chachere and Dmontre Wade are a couple of late round (6-7) guys who are qualifiers.

The news that the Packers are bring Mike Hughes in for a visit is interesting to me. The last time they draft a corner that short was Ahmad Carroll. Could they really be thinking of him at 14? Or do they think he is there at 45? Most are projecting him 25-40, interested to see how this plays out.

THANK YOU, RT. This is the exact type of info/discussion I was looking for. I generally know the size/speed minimums that they seem to hold over from the Wolf era, but it's hard to get a comprehensive list of these types of guys.

Any personal favorites on your end?

One guy I forgot to list is Quenton Meeks-Sanford who is 100% match, projects as a mid round (3-5) guy. I did have him listed on the big board thread, just spaced him out on this one.

For me the dream scenario would be that Jackson would slip out of the 1st round and the Packers trade up with Cleveland and get him at the top of the 2nd. The irony is that the Packers hopefully draft their starting corners for many years to come with the 1st pick in the 2nd round in back to back years with trades with the Browns. 

Of the mid round guys, I really like Tony Brown, very physical guy who should be a stud on special teams from day one. Could be the perfect replacement for Janis as the top gunner while learning the defense. Nic Nelson might also have a leg up on others because he has basically been playing the Packers new defense in college.
« Last Edit: April 03, 2018, 04:36:38 PM by RT »

Offline OneTwoSixFive

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Re: Cornerbacks... who do you like?
« Reply #11 on: April 03, 2018, 05:22:05 PM »
Second round possibilities:
Any of Carlton Davis (Auburn), Jaire Alexander (Louisville), Mike Highes (Cent. Florida), Isiah Oliver (Colorado), Josh Jackson (Iowa). All different guys, but similar in grading. Most of these should be there early in round two. All are a notch below Denzel Ward, who looks like a top 15 (round 1) pick.

Three round three targets:
Tony Brown (Alabama) has really serious speed, and plays physical, but needs fundamentals work for technique to catch up with his athleticism.
Quenton Meeks (Stanford) surprised with a 4.49 40 at his pro day, speed was the biggest knock on him so the 40 time will help him. Fights for the ball, good instincts. He needs work on transitioning from his backpedal.
Duke Dawson (Florida) is a shorter guy but built like a running back (5'11", 208). Instinctive, loose-hipped, knows how to jam. A bit grabby, which he will have to tone down in the NFL.

Round four.
Rashaan Gaulden (Tennessee). 6'1" guy who never ran a great 40 but has field speed. Tough, emotional (sometimes to his detriment), good motor and versatile.
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Offline dannobanano

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Offline WTX_Cheese

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Re: Cornerbacks... who do you like?
« Reply #13 on: April 04, 2018, 08:04:19 AM »
Thanks, OneTwoSixFive. I need to go back and look at those guys!

Offline RT

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Re: Cornerbacks... who do you like?
« Reply #14 on: April 04, 2018, 09:29:28 AM »
I find myself wondering if the Packers are going to continue to use the same CB criteria that they have used during the Ted Thompson era, or are they going to make adjustments to that criteria to maybe better fit what Pettine wants in boundary CB's.

Pettine might view Hughes as a slot defender, rather than a boundary defender.

JMHO

I thought the samething about the possiblity that they may well have tweaked the criteria from the past, but these benchmarks go back to Ron Wolf. It is not just a TT thing. As for Pettine having any influence into changing player types that are drafted, I would need proof of that. I know fans think he has come to save the day and he is wielding power to do whatever he wants, but I think his input on who is drafted is just slightly more than zero percent.

Then why would they hire a guy to fix this defense if he has no say in the players that get picked for it? I think too many fans here are in some variant of Stockholm syndrome from the TT era. It was very clear TT didn't give a damn what coaches wanted or take the input of his personnel team very highly. Thus the exodus of execs and the frustration of players and coaches. Most teams let their coaches have an input because it's a team effort, that includes coaches. Coaches are the subject matter experts of the game being played on the field. To downplay them is sad and I think the new power structure was created to avoid such a scenario.

When Pettine was hired, did he hire the assistants that are going to work under him? Incase you don't know the answer, the answer is no, MM did all the hiring of HIS coaching staff, not Pettine's staff. Now if he doesn't even pick his staff, why would you believe he is selecting players to be drafted? In this new delusional world of new DC Pettine selecting the defensive players in the draft, does that mean that new OC Philbin is selecting the offensive players to be drafted? As much as this is probably going to be a major letdown for some, but Pettine didn't fly into Green Bay wearing a cap and declaring he was there to save the Packers world. I'm fairly certain Pettine know what his new job is even if some fans sadly don't. 

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