November 18, 2018, 04:56:44 PM

Author Topic: Matching need to Best Player with first picks  (Read 1816 times)

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Offline packdaddy

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Matching need to Best Player with first picks
« on: December 17, 2017, 05:38:55 PM »
What do you think are our top 4 needs, and who would you draft to fill those needs (I'm sure that goes against some of your sensibilities -- just play along why don't ya)?

I'm guessing we end up with 4 picks in the first 3 rounds because of comp picks.

I say: Rush LB, CB, Safety, TE

1. Rush LB: pick 'em - Harold Landry, Arden Key, Ogbonnia Okoronkwo - whichever of those three are available with our 1st pick, in that order

2. CB: MJ Stewart, UNC.  Good size, strength, speed, awareness/ball skills, mixes it up agains the run.  Can play press. (200 tackles, 6 ints, 41 PBU for as a four-year starter)

3a. Safety:  DeShon Elliot, Texas.  Excels in coverage. a Free Safety type. A bit of a one-year wonder causes him to slide.

3b. TE:  Mike Gesicki, Penn State.  Good size, flashed being more than a possession TE his JR year.

Offline golfman

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Re: Matching need to Best Player with first picks
« Reply #1 on: December 17, 2017, 05:44:12 PM »
What do you think are our top 4 needs, and who would you draft to fill those needs (I'm sure that goes against some of your sensibilities -- just play along why don't ya)?

I'm guessing we end up with 4 picks in the first 3 rounds because of comp picks.

I say: Rush LB, CB, Safety, TE

1. Rush LB: pick 'em - Harold Landry, Arden Key, Ogbonnia Okoronkwo - whichever of those three are available with our 1st pick, in that order

2. CB: MJ Stewart, UNC.  Good size, strength, speed, awareness/ball skills, mixes it up agains the run.  Can play press. (200 tackles, 6 ints, 41 PBU for as a four-year starter)

3a. Safety:  DeShon Elliot, Texas.  Excels in coverage. a Free Safety type. A bit of a one-year wonder causes him to slide.

3b. TE:  Mike Gesicki, Penn State.  Good size, flashed being more than a possession TE his JR year.

Perhaps I'm missing something but where is 3b coming from? I don't think we'll get a 3rd round comp pick and do not remember us getting a pick that high in a trade.
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Online ricky

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Re: Matching need to Best Player with first picks
« Reply #2 on: December 17, 2017, 05:53:09 PM »
Perhaps I'm missing something but where is 3b coming from? I don't think we'll get a 3rd round comp pick and do not remember us getting a pick that high in a trade.

So, which position/player do you like? By the third round, is it likely both players would be available when the Packers are drafting? So, effectively, pick one of the options, depending on where you prioritize a need for the Packers.
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Offline Pugger

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Re: Matching need to Best Player with first picks
« Reply #3 on: December 17, 2017, 06:31:44 PM »
We need an EDGE rusher or 3.  We also need overall speed on this defense.  On offense we need a WR and a TE who can stretch the field.

Offline Leader

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Re: Matching need to Best Player with first picks
« Reply #4 on: December 17, 2017, 06:56:37 PM »
I'm just gonna drop this here - but I'm seriously considering Jordy may be done. Perhaps he's got some lingering injury or issue - although theres been no hint of such - but he's not moving right anymore.

A stat was posted indicating the GBPs were #2 in the league with CAP money designated to the WR position. With AR around - makes sense - but no way we can jack that higher with Adams cashing in. Somebody's gotta go - or their salary has to. Nelson? Cobb? - I'd lean towards Nelson - simply because of his steep drop off.

Offline packdaddy

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Re: Matching need to Best Player with first picks
« Reply #5 on: December 17, 2017, 07:05:22 PM »
What do you think are our top 4 needs, and who would you draft to fill those needs (I'm sure that goes against some of your sensibilities -- just play along why don't ya)?

I'm guessing we end up with 4 picks in the first 3 rounds because of comp picks.

I say: Rush LB, CB, Safety, TE

1. Rush LB: pick 'em - Harold Landry, Arden Key, Ogbonnia Okoronkwo - whichever of those three are available with our 1st pick, in that order

2. CB: MJ Stewart, UNC.  Good size, strength, speed, awareness/ball skills, mixes it up agains the run.  Can play press. (200 tackles, 6 ints, 41 PBU for as a four-year starter)

3a. Safety:  DeShon Elliot, Texas.  Excels in coverage. a Free Safety type. A bit of a one-year wonder causes him to slide.

3b. TE:  Mike Gesicki, Penn State.  Good size, flashed being more than a possession TE his JR year.

Perhaps I'm missing something but where is 3b coming from? I don't think we'll get a 3rd round comp pick and do not remember us getting a pick that high in a trade.

Of course, nothing is set in stone, but several places on the intraweb predict a 3rd for the Pack this year. 

Offline golfman

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Re: Matching need to Best Player with first picks
« Reply #6 on: December 17, 2017, 07:19:22 PM »
Perhaps I'm missing something but where is 3b coming from? I don't think we'll get a 3rd round comp pick and do not remember us getting a pick that high in a trade.

So, which position/player do you like? By the third round, is it likely both players would be available when the Packers are drafting? So, effectively, pick one of the options, depending on where you prioritize a need for the Packers.

If I go by CBS current ranking of players here is my ideal draft through round 3.

1. Arden Key DE/OLB LSU(he'll move into the top 10 by draft day)
2. Cameron Kelly CB San Diego State (Willie Buchanon's alma mater)
3. Mike Gesicki TE Penn State (I'd take the kid (TE) from Wisconsin here too or a WR)
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Online ricky

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Re: Matching need to Best Player with first picks
« Reply #7 on: December 17, 2017, 07:59:49 PM »
I'm just gonna drop this here - but I'm seriously considering Jordy may be done. Perhaps he's got some lingering injury or issue - although theres been no hint of such - but he's not moving right anymore.

A stat was posted indicating the GBPs were #2 in the league with CAP money designated to the WR position. With AR around - makes sense - but no way we can jack that higher with Adams cashing in. Somebody's gotta go - or their salary has to. Nelson? Cobb? - I'd lean towards Nelson - simply because of his steep drop off.

I thought the return of Rodgers would mean a big day for Nelson. Instead, it was more of the same, lack of produciton. Adams and Cobb did fine, and although he is scoffed at, Richard Rodgers has great hands. As I wrote in another thread, he is older and gives the team more cap relief with a smaller dead cap hit. Sometimes a player has a sudden decline. Why? Accumulated wear and tear? Genes? Age? This is not something I am happy about or looking forward to happening. But it seems Jordy will be the "odd man out" when it comes to forming a team next year.  :-\
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Offline SET4YRS

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Re: Matching need to Best Player with first picks
« Reply #8 on: December 17, 2017, 09:26:16 PM »
  Here's a list of some of the players I like that could fill some needs over the next couple years, or just may be too good to pass up. After the process they may end up in these rounds.                                                                                                                       

 1) WR Courtland Sutton , DE/DT Christian Wilkins, OLB Dorance Armstrong, OLB Harlod Landry

 2) WR Parris Campbell, DE/OLB Sam Hubbard, TE Mark Andrews, G Billy Price

 3) OLB Marcel Frazier, RB Royce Freeman, ILB Micah Kiser, WR Simmie Cobbs Jr.

 4) G Maea Teuhema, TE Mike Gesicki, TE Hayden Hurst, CB Michael Jackson, CB Jamaal Peters

 I really hope they can restructure/extend some big contracts, land Jimmy Graham, and keep our core together. It was too bad #12 went down this year, I liked what they did with the roster. It sure looked like we could make a run.

Offline DWhitehurst

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Re: Matching need to Best Player with first picks
« Reply #9 on: December 17, 2017, 10:24:15 PM »
Agreed that either Cobb or Nelson may have to go. Nelson makes more sense given age, but dang, it will still be a sad day when it happens. I mean, I can't think of a higher character guy than Nelson. Cobb as well. :(

Offline OneTwoSixFive

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Re: Matching need to Best Player with first picks
« Reply #10 on: December 18, 2017, 03:47:02 AM »
My latest Fanspeak foray netted me:
Edge Clellin Ferrell, Clemson (Bradley Chubb had dropped and was also available, but he is more a pure DE in my mind)
WR Courtland Sutton, SMU. He is slated to go higher, but in this draft both he and WR Washington were still there in round 2.
CB Jaire Alexander, Louisville (CB Anthony Averett, Alabama went about three picks before the Packers picked in round 3, he would be another good choice).

That would add a lot of talent to key weaknesses. Also worth noting is that the release of TE Bennett before the week 10 cutoff helps the Packers compensatory picks. Ovetthecap has them getting a third and three 5th round picks. However, the third rounder is the lowest one, as is one of the 5ths, so at worst maybe a 4th, 2x5ths, 1x6th. I'd love for the 3rd rounder to stay there because that would bring into play a TE like Ian Thomas (Indiana), or Mike Gesicki (Penn State).

That would leave round 4 for a safety, an o lineman, or a second OLB. That would be a balanced draft (Def, Off, Def, Off, either). Now if only the Packers can stay relatively healthy next year. There will always be injuries, but hopefully not to the handful of key guys.
« Last Edit: December 18, 2017, 04:16:44 AM by OneTwoSixFive »
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Online claymaker

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Re: Matching need to Best Player with first picks
« Reply #11 on: December 19, 2017, 01:45:25 PM »
Why Safety? They're pretty set with Clinton-Dix and Burnett as their starters with Brice and Jones as backups. They might be the only team in the league with that sort of depth. On defense it's last on my priority list.

For pass rushers I like Dorance Armstrong from Kansas. Austin Bryant from Clemson looks good too. Of the top guys, I think they will be available to Green Bay. Keep an eye on day 2 for Lorenzo Carter from Georgia as well.

Cornerbacks are okay this year. Jaire Alexander from Louisville and Donte Jackson from LSU catch my eye. Devontae Harris from Illinois State is a guy to watch.

I like Roqoun Smith from Georgia. Upgrade from Martinez. It'd be hard to pass on him if he's available.

WR is on my radar, but not a huge need. If the right guy is there for them like Adams was in 2014 I don't think they shy away from picking one.

For TEs I really like Dalton Schultz from Stanford. Great run blocker and I feel like he has good enough speed to be a receiving weapon.




« Last Edit: December 19, 2017, 01:46:13 PM by claymaker »

Offline dannobanano

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Re: Matching need to Best Player with first picks
« Reply #12 on: December 19, 2017, 05:44:15 PM »
Why Safety? They're pretty set with Clinton-Dix and Burnett as their starters with Brice and Jones as backups. They might be the only team in the league with that sort of depth. On defense it's last on my priority list.

For pass rushers I like Dorance Armstrong from Kansas. Austin Bryant from Clemson looks good too. Of the top guys, I think they will be available to Green Bay. Keep an eye on day 2 for Lorenzo Carter from Georgia as well.

Cornerbacks are okay this year. Jaire Alexander from Louisville and Donte Jackson from LSU catch my eye. Devontae Harris from Illinois State is a guy to watch.

I like Roqoun Smith from Georgia. Upgrade from Martinez. It'd be hard to pass on him if he's available.

WR is on my radar, but not a huge need. If the right guy is there for them like Adams was in 2014 I don't think they shy away from picking one.

For TEs I really like Dalton Schultz from Stanford. Great run blocker and I feel like he has good enough speed to be a receiving weapon.

I like a lot of those choices you mention clay.

For the 1st Round I'd just like to see BPA for a change, rather than draft for "need" at any position except QB/K/P. I'd also add Edge Rusher Marcell Frazier (Mizzu) in 2nd round, and in the 3rd TE Dallas Goedert (South Dakota St)......he had a sick Jr campaign (2016) with 92 receptions/1293 yds/11 TD's, and in the 4th Edge Rusher Sione Teuhema (Southeast Louisiana)

Offline OneTwoSixFive

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Re: Matching need to Best Player with first picks
« Reply #13 on: December 20, 2017, 03:24:32 AM »
Why Safety? They're pretty set with Clinton-Dix and Burnett as their starters with Brice and Jones as backups. They might be the only team in the league with that sort of depth. On defense it's last on my priority list.

I listed safety, later in the draft, because I'm expecting the Packers to lose Burnett (which may be why they drafted J.Jones). A pick there would round out the unit again.

For pass rushers I like Dorance Armstrong from Kansas. Austin Bryant from Clemson looks good too. Of the top guys, I think they will be available to Green Bay. Keep an eye on day 2 for Lorenzo Carter from Georgia as well.

Good picks. Bryant took his chance when Clelin Ferrell went down. Dorance is a little lighter than ideal and Bryant a little heavier (I like OLBs at 255 lb), but the differences are not large and can be adjusted in camp. Carter has the great length you love to see at OLB.

Cornerbacks are okay this year. Jaire Alexander from Louisville and Donte Jackson from LSU catch my eye. Devontae Harris from Illinois State is a guy to watch.

CB is meant to be down this year - certainly down from an excellent draft (for them) last year. I really wanted Fabian Moreau, who lasted until #81 (Resdkins), but it was not to be. I like Denzel Ward this year, but at 5'10", he may be off the Packers draft board.

I like Roqoun Smith from Georgia. Upgrade from Martinez. It'd be hard to pass on him if he's available.

I can't see a need for anything other than a late developmental pick here after the Packers spent a 4th (Ryan), another 4th (Martinez) and a 2nd (J.Jones), the last three years.

WR is on my radar, but not a huge need. If the right guy is there for them like Adams was in 2014 I don't think they shy away from picking one.

For me it's a big need. Draft one high this year, to be a starter outside next year. If D. Adams gets the big payday (which he should), Jordy may not even be on the team next year due to there being 3 receivers on $12m+ if he is kept. I think he is really slipping this year and could be a cut - shocking, I know.

For TEs I really like Dalton Schultz from Stanford. Great run blocker and I feel like he has good enough speed to be a receiving weapon.

I have no problems with getting a decent TE as long as he is fast enough to be successful going deep in the midfield. I would rate OLB, CB and WR above TE, but the draft doesn't always fall out by the numbers. If a good TE is best value, take him. Wisconsin's Fumagelli is the most advanced prospect, with the hands smarts, good route running and blocking, but he just isn't the field stretcher that Penn State's Gesicki is. Maybe I need to step away from my overriding desire for a seam stretcher, and just go for a guy who plays very well.
« Last Edit: December 20, 2017, 03:26:55 AM by OneTwoSixFive »
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Online ricky

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Re: Matching need to Best Player with first picks
« Reply #14 on: December 20, 2017, 04:30:24 AM »
Want to see a big improvement in the Packers defense next season? Hire a new DC. For proof, look no further than the LA Rams. In 2016, they ended the year ranked #23 in defense. This year, #5. So, did they do it through the addition of FA's or through the draft? Lets see. First, here is the Rams FA signings and losses this season: https://www.si.com/nfl/2017/06/02/los-angeles-rams-offseason-grades-free-agency-nfl-draft

There doesn't seem to be a major acquistiion there. So, they must have drafted some real defensive studs, right? Lets look:
http://www.espn.com/blog/los-angeles-rams/post/_/id/33558/los-angeles-rams-2017-draft-picks-analysis-for-every-selection
Looks like they went heavily on offense during the draft, since their first defensive player was their second pick in the third round.

So, why the change in LA defensively? They hired Wade Phillips as their DC. Is there any guarantee the Packers would see a similar turnaround? No. But a new DC could very well bring in new energy, a new attitude, and a fresh look at how to use the players the Packers have now. Sure, draft some guys, and I still would like to add a big time FA defender. But if they don't go big in FA, and with TT that is unlikely (also, they have some guys they're going to want to re-sign), then a re-imagining of the defense from an outsider would be welcome. Someone on here said it seemed likely Vic Fangio would be available if the Bears fire Fox, which seems likely.Great. Snap him up. But if not him, someone else from outside the organization.

And for those who want to say the Rams have significantly better defensive personnel, fine. But the team still took a jump from #23 to #5 in one year with no significant changes except at DC. Effectively same personnel, just a change at the top. I know I'm preaching to the choir on this one, but my main point is that I believe the Packers have the players, for the most part. What they need is better leadership/schemes/plans/looks, whatever you want to call it. Vic at Packers.com always preached "players, not schemes". But if the schemes are stale and predictable, and don't work, time to try something new. So either you blow up the defensive side of the ball and start over, with a few exceptions, or you try new concepts. The Rams chose to go for the second route, and its paid off big. Time for the Packers to follow suit.

Want to be even more depressed/distressed by the defense? Opponents have gotten first downs 80% of the time on fourth down this season. Four times out of five.
« Last Edit: December 20, 2017, 04:37:05 AM by ricky »
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