May 26, 2018, 08:09:41 PM

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Green Bay Packers News Talk / Re: Packers transactions
« Last post by dannobanano on Today at 05:32:43 AM »
For me, the problems in fielding a competitive receiver group (WRs and TEs) is especially acute this year. While I think Graham+Adams+Cobb helps the Packers get over the early games, J'mon Moore could get some snaps as the WR opposite Adams. I don't expect to see Valdez-Scantling or St.Brown playing WR much in 2018.

The problem with having TEs Graham and Lewis is that Lewis is pretty much a pure blocker while Graham is a pure receiver. The Packers lack a decent do-it-all guy, so I expect plenty of 2xTE sets. I also expect creative use of Ty Montgomery coming out of the backfield and catching the ball. I don't think he will ever be a true WR again, but he can be a good utility piece catching and running (and hopefully blocking). The blocking of the RBs is another reason to see plenty of TE Lewis, it isn't good. FB Ripkowski can sub for Lewis as a pass blocker, if needed, at least HE can block.

Thinking of how the 11 players on the field stack up, OL+Lewis is 6, QB makes 7, Adams and Graham wide, Cobb in the slot, makes 10 and RB Monty is 11, that might be the best pass catchers on the field right there (while still keeping a 6th man in to pass block). As a changeup, slide in WR Moore for TE Graham sometimes, and switch TE Lewis and RB Montgomery for FB Ripkowski and RB Jones or Williams. It's workable, but has drawbacks in being a short-term fix, and lacking much depth if anyone goes down.

Next draft, as much as the Packers are desperate for another top pass rusher, a starter-level TE is needed and probably  a starter-level WR opposite Adams (that is if Moore doesn't bust out as someone good enough to be a starter outside). In the near future, Lewis, Graham and Cobb are all probably gone, and it is very difficult to replace three offensive starters in one year with rookies, even talented ones. If the Packers don't hit on one of their rookie receivers this year (and their recent record with later WR picks is bad), they'll need another WR starter as well, which is why there are a lot of hopes pinned on Moore, or less likely, Valdez-Scantling and St.Brown, to make a successful transition to the NFL.

I think too many folks are writing off Lewis as a receiver simply because he is such a good blocker and that's how he was mostly used in JAX.

Lost in the weeds is his pro-bowl season of 2010 where he had 58 receptions/700 yds/10 TDs, and that from and that from 2007 thru 2012 his reception totals were 37-41-32-58-39-52. So he has shown over his career that he can be a factor in the passing game.

His he Jimmy Graham? Heck no! But is that what GB wants him to be? Heck No! I suspect that his presence on the field with Graham and others will compel defenses to respect the running game, which should open up a lot more plat action opportunities for #12.

We also have to consider that over his career in JAX, Lewis has had David Garrard, Blaine Gabbert, Chad Henne, and Blake Bortles as his starting quarterbacks.
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Green Bay Packers News Talk / Re: Packers transactions
« Last post by scoremore on Today at 04:23:37 AM »
Love how everyone seemingly writes off the new group of Packer receivers merely because of draft position.  OK look at the odds of a late round pick making an impact that's the argument.  Looking at EQ I see an extremely athletic and highly intelligent guy.  Had he been drafted in the 2nd round everyone would automatically anoint him as the next great Packer receiver.  But because he was drafted in the 6th he's trash.  See no reason why he shouldn't succeed in the NFL. 

We have enough guys to work with at WR.  Develop what we have no need to draft anymore of them.  Think Moore and EQ are both going to hit.  Scantling might need a little more time. Don't care where they were picked shouldn't matter.  TE is another story.  Next year the Pack will have to draft a couple of guys there.

Not just looking through green and gold glasses.  Was luke warm on the WR's taken last year.  Liked Yancey actually.  Seems like a good future possession receiver.  This new group of guys has me much more excited.  EQ intelligent (Aaron is going to love this kid), Moore has got that shifty Greg Jennings type quality to him, and Scantling is just a blazing fast  guy who should excel at special teams right away.  His greatest attribute besides his speed is his attitude. 

Takes a few years to develop these guys.  We'll get some early returns most likely from Moore.  Given time to acclimate to the NFL all 3 have the tools to succeed.  Ultimately think EQ might end up being the best of the bunch and could eventually be our #1 guy.  Kid is going to be a stud.  In a weak WR class Gute managed to pluck out some really fine prospects.  We can all comment one way or another but won't really know what we have for a few years.  Just my opinion after digging around and studying these guys.

Point is don't just look at draft position look at the player.  If Cobb goes next year one of these guys will be ready to pick up the mantle.  Think the future is set at WR.  TE obviously is not.  Looking at next year's draft TE, OT, OLB, RB will be the targets. 
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Green Bay Packers News Talk / Re: Packers transactions
« Last post by OneTwoSixFive on Today at 02:19:39 AM »
For me, the problems in fielding a competitive receiver group (WRs and TEs) is especially acute this year. While I think Graham+Adams+Cobb helps the Packers get over the early games, J'mon Moore could get some snaps as the WR opposite Adams. I don't expect to see Valdez-Scantling or St.Brown playing WR much in 2018.

The problem with having TEs Graham and Lewis is that Lewis is pretty much a pure blocker while Graham is a pure receiver. The Packers lack a decent do-it-all guy, so I expect plenty of 2xTE sets. I also expect creative use of Ty Montgomery coming out of the backfield and catching the ball. I don't think he will ever be a true WR again, but he can be a good utility piece catching and running (and hopefully blocking). The blocking of the RBs is another reason to see plenty of TE Lewis, it isn't good. FB Ripkowski can sub for Lewis as a pass blocker, if needed, at least HE can block.

Thinking of how the 11 players on the field stack up, OL+Lewis is 6, QB makes 7, Adams and Graham wide, Cobb in the slot, makes 10 and RB Monty is 11, that might be the best pass catchers on the field right there (while still keeping a 6th man in to pass block). As a changeup, slide in WR Moore for TE Graham sometimes, and switch TE Lewis and RB Montgomery for FB Ripkowski and RB Jones or Williams. It's workable, but has drawbacks in being a short-term fix, and lacking much depth if anyone goes down.

Next draft, as much as the Packers are desperate for another top pass rusher, a starter-level TE is needed and probably  a starter-level WR opposite Adams (that is if Moore doesn't bust out as someone good enough to be a starter outside). In the near future, Lewis, Graham and Cobb are all probably gone, and it is very difficult to replace three offensive starters in one year with rookies, even talented ones. If the Packers don't hit on one of their rookie receivers this year (and their recent record with later WR picks is bad), they'll need another WR starter as well, which is why there are a lot of hopes pinned on Moore, or less likely, Valdez-Scantling and St.Brown, to make a successful transition to the NFL.
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Green Bay Packers News Talk / Re: Packers transactions
« Last post by craig on May 25, 2018, 06:09:57 PM »
....Does your roster perception and the construction of it change if you put WR next to Jimmy Graham's name? All the hand-wringing by fans and the need to add a WR to replace the lose of Nelson may well be for no reason at all. When the Packers go to a 3 WR set, the 3 WR's will be Adams, Cobb and Graham. When that reality sets in for fans is their any need to sign a veteran WR? ....

Given the lack of a good WR opposite Adams, and the complementary abilities of TE Graham as a pass catcher, and Lewis as a blocker, I forsee a significant amount of Graham and Lewis on the field together.

You can split Graham out wide and have Lewis blocking. Adams +Graham +Cobb catching passes, with Lewis able to leak out with a block-and-release for the occasional catch, and Montgomery who might run it out the backfield or catch the ball more like a receiver, or stay at home and block. that could work.

Thanks for both posts.  Objective. 

Some mixed feelings, myself, though.  Sure, you can call Graham 3rd WR, and say all is well, you've got all the receivers you want.  And Yes, I expect MM will run plenty of Graham/receiver/receiver sets. 
**Lewis is a blocker, not a catcher.  Hasn't exceeded 25 catches since 2012.  Isn't he a lineman who averages 1 catch per game, and your chance to play U-71 as your staple offense? 
**Aaron Rodgers is great and the reason the Packers can consider themselves Super Bowl contenders.  Is playing U-71 all the time with only 3 targets optimal use of Rodgers greatness?
**Rodgers says he throws to the open guy.  Is sending out only 3 targets against nickel and dime defenses a great way to enable any of Graham/Adams/Cobb to get open? 
**Graham's a not-young TE.  Cobb and Adams aren't fast.  Does using that 3-receiver set give you any downfield clearance?  I understand speed isn't everything, see Janis.  Going with with Graham as your 3rd speed-WR and Lewis as your TE, that's not going to be life in the fast lane. 

I guess part of me wonders if Rodgers and the offense might benefit by sometimes using 4 targets like back in the Finley days?  Going downfield sometimes? Putting out a receiving TE plus three WR?  Creating some 1-on-1's? 

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Green Bay Packers News Talk / Re: Packers transactions
« Last post by craig on May 25, 2018, 05:24:37 PM »
Does this complicate the mix of the "other" WR's GB might be keeping (Allison, Clark, Moore, MVS, ESB)??
Or, does it send a signal to Cobb that he needs to be "lights out" to keep from being cut ...

No, re Cobb
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Green Bay Packers News Talk / Re: Packers transactions
« Last post by Twain on May 25, 2018, 04:51:34 PM »
I don't see this signing as a threat to Kendricks.  Tight ends are useful as a they are big bodies with athleticism.

For a spot that was very thin at the start of free agency, they have done a good job of filling it in.  I feel much better about the position with the three vets and then some competition for a fourth and maybe fifth spot between some developmental players.
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Green Bay Packers News Talk / Re: Packers transactions
« Last post by dannobanano on May 25, 2018, 10:51:22 AM »
Does this complicate the mix of the "other" WR's GB might be keeping (Allison, Clark, Moore, MVS, ESB)??

Or, does it send a signal to Cobb that he needs to be "lights out" to keep from being cut (especially in light of the Packers wanting to play Adams significantly more from the slot).??

https://packerswire.usatoday.com/2018/05/23/aaron-rodgers-expects-more-snaps-from-the-slot-for-wr-davante-adams/
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Green Bay Packers News Talk / Re: Packers transactions
« Last post by OneTwoSixFive on May 25, 2018, 10:42:46 AM »
Given the lack of a good WR opposite Adams, and the complementary abilities of TE Graham as a pass catcher, and Lewis as a blocker, I forsee a significant amount of Graham and Lewis on the field together.

You can split Graham out wide and have Lewis blocking. Adams +Graham +Cobb catching passes, with Lewis able to leak out with a block-and-release for the occasional catch, and Montgomery who might run it out the backfield or catch the ball more like a receiver, or stay at home and block. that could work.
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Green Bay Packers News Talk / Re: OTA notes
« Last post by RT on May 25, 2018, 06:06:11 AM »
Yeah, I respectfully disagree on this, I think, at least as regards center.   I think you're oversimplifying, as regards center. 

Snapping and transitioning from the snap position into blocking position is physiologically kinda different, and is also something of a developed skill.  So I don't really assume that if 6 and 7 are better than 8 at tackle and guard, that they're also necessarily better than 8 at center.  Not sure that you can just plug in Spriggs or Murphy at center. 

I would think that of the Patrick, Amichia, Day, Alsadek and Davis pentet, if better is simply interchangeably better and the best guard is necessarily the best center as well, that would be really good for Patrick.  And good for the Packers.  I think he's shown himself to be perfectly serviceable as a backup guard; so if that also means he'd be perfectly serviceable as a backup center as well, that's good news for us!  And if it turns out that one of the other guys is even better than perfectly serviceable, that's even better news for the Packers.

Not claiming you are right or wrong and I do get the concern about the lose of a center during a game.

Taking a minute and putting the cart before the horse here and assuming some roster positions, we can do a hypothetical. Say the starting 5 are Bakhtairi, Taylor, Linsley, McCray, Bulaga (I believe Bulaga starts the year on the PUP and either Spriggs or Murphy is the starting RT on opening day) and Spriggs and Murphy makeup the 7 game day actives. In this scenario if Linsley would go down, McCray moves to center and Murphy moves into RG. Remember that McCray was for the mostpart the backup center all of last season.

Now say the team keeps the 8th or 9th best OLineman active on game day because he is a natural center and they lose their OT's during the game. Would you rather be in a game with your 7 best OLineman active or with your 6th and 8th/9th best OLineman active? No one knows in advance who is going to get injured during the course of a game, but for me I want the 7 best active for game day.

With that said, the roster spots are yet to be determined and many different combinations could come out of this yet, but history tells us they will play the best 5 and activate the best 7.
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Green Bay Packers News Talk / Re: Packers transactions
« Last post by RT on May 25, 2018, 05:35:33 AM »
Interesting, that was quick.  I wonder how much $$?  Can't imagine too much.  Don't think he's ever been used much as a target, right?  Basically a blocker who might leak out and catch one or two or three short passes? 

I wonder if that just makes it easy, and they keep all three vets?  Or if that might put Kendricks on the bubble?

I have thought those same things craig. Does your roster perception and the construction of it change if you put WR next to Jimmy Graham's name? All the hand-wringing by fans and the need to add a WR to replace the lose of Nelson may well be for no reason at all. When the Packers go to a 3 WR set, the 3 WR's will be Adams, Cobb and Graham. When that reality sets in for fans is their any need to sign a veteran WR? As for Kendricks, I have felt since season end that they may be looking to replace him, still not sure of the Packers thought process on that one. Backup TE's typically need to be heavy contributors on ST's, not an ideal position for 30 somethings in the NFL.
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