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General Category => Green Bay Packers News Talk => Topic started by: marklawrence on October 29, 2018, 11:11:49 AM

Title: Montgomery
Post by: marklawrence on October 29, 2018, 11:11:49 AM
Trent Dilfer heard from a couple of guys who were on the sideline that he trusts that Montgomery had the discussion on the sideline with one of his coaches to stay in the end-zone and make sure #12 had a chance to win the game.  Montgomery had missed a block on the previous possession and was ticked about being taken out.  So he decided he'd do what he wanted to...... IMHO Ty should be traded today or cut.  You can't  have that level of disrespect.
Title: Re: Montgomery
Post by: rock county on October 29, 2018, 11:29:51 AM
Cut him if nobody is dumb enough to trade for him.

He plays no specific position well, frequently gets hurt and now is becoming a cancer to the team. 

He shouldn't have even made final roster.
Title: Re: Montgomery
Post by: Whiskey Sam on October 29, 2018, 11:46:31 AM
Yep, he should be cut. If they won't cut him, MM should bench him. If neither happens, they have lost control of this team.
Title: Re: Montgomery
Post by: The GM on October 29, 2018, 11:55:48 AM
Disagree, keep him, use him to his strengths.  He should be catching 60-70 balls out of the backfield.  If you saw Gurley out of the backfield yesterday, across the middle and down the sidelines, that's what Montgomery is capable of in the passing game.    We choose to use stale screen passes everybody sees coming.  When was the last time you saw a Packer RB catch a pass downfield????? Montgomery should be a major part of this offense.  Im not saying the every down back, but as a major weapon defenses need to account for as a receiver coming out of the backfield.
Title: Re: Montgomery
Post by: scoremore on October 29, 2018, 12:10:04 PM
Could go either way on this one.  Emotionally cut his ass today.  Logically cut his ass today.  Through Green and Gold rose colored glasses give the kid a chance to redeem himself.  Honestly I am sure Monty feels lower than dirt at the moment.  If he begs and pleads to keep his job and redoubles his effort to be help the team well?  He'll also need to apologize to all his teammates for screwing up so badly.  Packers will make the right decision either way.  He probably cost us a W.  Now it's up to him to make a difference.  He hasn't exactly set the world on fire.  He'll need to now.
Title: Re: Montgomery
Post by: packdaddy on October 29, 2018, 12:51:58 PM
Trent Dilfer heard from a couple of guys who were on the sideline that he trusts that Montgomery had the discussion on the sideline with one of his coaches to stay in the end-zone and make sure #12 had a chance to win the game.  Montgomery had missed a block on the previous possession and was ticked about being taken out.  So he decided he'd do what he wanted to...... IMHO Ty should be traded today or cut.  You can't  have that level of disrespect.

Totally agree.  If true, and staff lets it go, that could really hurt the locker room.  Can't have a mutiny.  Cut him today (if true).
Title: Re: Montgomery
Post by: Bignutz on October 29, 2018, 02:14:53 PM
Trent Dilfer heard from a couple of guys who were on the sideline that he trusts that Montgomery had the discussion on the sideline with one of his coaches to stay in the end-zone and make sure #12 had a chance to win the game.  Montgomery had missed a block on the previous possession and was ticked about being taken out.  So he decided he'd do what he wanted to...... IMHO Ty should be traded today or cut.  You can't  have that level of disrespect.

Agree! The other thing to consider is how can the coaches ever trust him again not to take matters into his own hands?
Title: Re: Montgomery
Post by: The GM on October 29, 2018, 02:18:33 PM
It would be foolish to cut Montgomery.  Part of a trade? Perhaps.  Cut him?, NO CHANCE!!!
Title: Re: Montgomery
Post by: ricky on October 29, 2018, 03:00:25 PM
How do you handle players who don't follow the rules? You discipline them. This seems obvious, but it seems that Montgomery is going to get away with defying (apparently) the coaching staff. What should be done? I'd cut him. And I hate the thought of ending the dreams of young men who have worked so hard, Some coaches "get it", including the Packers next opponent:

https://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2018/10/29/report-josh-gordon-to-sit-part-of-mondays-game-as-disciplinary-measure/

So, how long would Montgomery have stayed in NE if he had done the same thing with the same results? This would have been resolved in a matter of hours.
Title: Re: Montgomery
Post by: JerryA on October 29, 2018, 03:14:39 PM
Yep, he should be cut. If they won't cut him, MM should bench him. If neither happens, they have lost control of this team.

If cut he might be picked up by another team just to pick his brain about the Packer's x and o's. On the top of that list might be NE!
Title: Re: Montgomery
Post by: scoremore on October 29, 2018, 03:31:03 PM
Monty said he was worried about taking a knee on the goal line or 1 yard line.  Honest mistake.  I'll take him at his word.  It was close.  He still screwed up royally.  Now some bad blood in the locker room.  It will have to be addressed.  Still doesn't change my stance.  He's a marginal player.  Not worth anything in trade IMO. 
Title: Re: Montgomery
Post by: The GM on October 29, 2018, 03:48:04 PM
Monty said he was worried about taking a knee on the goal line or 1 yard line.  Honest mistake.  I'll take him at his word.  It was close.  He stilled screwed up royally.  Now some bad blood in the locker room.  It will have to be addressed.  Still doesn't change my stance.  He's a marginal player.  Not worth anything in trade IMO.

It was an honest mistake, He said his decision had NOTHING to do with the previous series.  I think this rebellion theory is garbage and is being blown way out of proportion.  He wasnt sure where he was near the goaline,  I get that.  Do you down it at the 1 yard line???,  He's isnt stupid, he's a Stanford grad, and he knows all the Packers RB plays and WR routes (Many of them cant get i position right).  He regrets being called "selfish" by some annoymous teammate.   This was an honest mistake, he knows it, an overwhelming majority of his teammates know it and have his back.    Its on the Patriots next Sunday.   He and his family reportedly have received threats about this.  Unreal!!!
Title: Re: Montgomery
Post by: mtsportsfan on October 29, 2018, 03:57:40 PM
Disagree, keep him, use him to his strengths.  He should be catching 60-70 balls out of the backfield.  If you saw Gurley out of the backfield yesterday, across the middle and down the sidelines, that's what Montgomery is capable of in the passing game.    We choose to use stale screen passes everybody sees coming.  When was the last time you saw a Packer RB catch a pass downfield????? Montgomery should be a major part of this offense.  Im not saying the every down back, but as a major weapon defenses need to account for as a receiver coming out of the backfield.
totally agree , not that I am a huge fan of Monty, but we don't really use him, or that matter the rest of the backs the way we should . Nailed it when u said about the backs down field, almost never. It seems that we always run there routes to the sidelines  and a few yards off the line of scrimmage. Rarely do we try to use the middle of the field.
Title: Re: Montgomery
Post by: phanatic1 on October 29, 2018, 04:15:01 PM
The cat is kind of out of the bag with Montgomery.  Despite what Tramon Williams says, you gotta believe that there is a good chunk of the locker room that isn't just going to say ok and move on.  What was said - yes it was anonymous - but it sure doesn't sound like it was just 1 guys opinion. 

Players claimed that Capers held no one accountable the past few years and were frustrated by that.  Here is a chance for MM to make a statement.  But, knowing how MM operates, I would anticipate Montgomery to stay around and a statement by MM that "we handled things internally" will probably be put out.  However, I would be shocked to see Montgomery returning kicks in the near future.  If he is, it shows a lot about MM.

I think RT pointed out that Trevor Davis could be reinstated back to the roster to return kicks.  That makes a ton of sense as right now, the punt and kick returns have been surely lacking any explosion. 
Title: Re: Montgomery
Post by: B on October 29, 2018, 04:17:11 PM
I'm not one to question a players intent. However, granting him the benefit of believing it was not defiance or related to his sideline temper tantrum at being pulled after missing a key block resulting in a potential game changing sack, it still does not mean he should be given a pass.

If it was a mistake, it was a mistake a veteran professional being trusted to have the ball in his hands at a critical moment in a BIG game should NOT make. A kick returners job is to be aware of his position on the field and the position of the team at such a critical time in a game. He failed to do his job, and the comparisons to Bostick and T.J. Rupley are warranted IMO
Title: Re: Montgomery
Post by: MrJuly4th on October 29, 2018, 04:40:25 PM
Ty Montgomery disobeyed orders on key fumble, angering Aaron Rodgers and Packers

https://www.yahoo.com/sports/ty-montgomery-disobeyed-orders-key-fumble-angering-aaron-rodgers-packers-141933668.html

“Aaron was hot,” one Packers coach told Silver. “And he had a right to be. He yelled, ‘Take a [expletive] knee!’ He was very, very mad.”
Title: Re: Montgomery
Post by: The GM on October 29, 2018, 05:55:13 PM
McCarthy called the media storm surrounding Montgomery's ill advised decision on the kickoff "Nonsense".
Title: Re: Montgomery
Post by: marklawrence on October 29, 2018, 06:22:54 PM
That end zone was pretty colorful. I'm having trouble with the idea he couldn't see if he was in the goal line.
Title: Re: Montgomery
Post by: packdaddy on October 29, 2018, 06:51:58 PM
Montgomery says:

"No one ever said anything to me. No one ever came to me."

Hmm.
Title: Re: Montgomery
Post by: marklawrence on October 29, 2018, 07:02:16 PM
Montgomery says:

"No one ever said anything to me. No one ever came to me."

Hmm.

I actually believe that. I have little confidence in this coaching staff communicating to the team during the game.
Title: Re: Montgomery
Post by: LaSeeno on October 29, 2018, 07:13:50 PM
Let’s not forget the atrocious play calling from the 1 up
10-0.  Don’t let MM blame this on TM.

Could have been 17-0 at half instead of 10-8...
Title: Re: Montgomery
Post by: packdaddy on October 29, 2018, 08:09:12 PM
Montgomery says:

"No one ever said anything to me. No one ever came to me."

Hmm.

I actually believe that. I have little confidence in this coaching staff communicating to the team during the game.

Sadly, I have to agree with you. But, if Montgomery is telling the truth, MM would have us believe otherwise. That would be a worse offense than not communicating, IMO.

And if you read the quotes from the presser by MM, they are very lawyer-esque.

Either way it's bad optics. Either he didn't communicate and now he's throwing a player under the bus, or he did communicate and one of his players went rogue.

Title: Re: Montgomery
Post by: Scott1956 on October 29, 2018, 08:18:35 PM
"Nonsense" McCarthy? Montgomery was as brilliant as you were trying to run the ball up the middle on your own 1/2 yard line against the 2 best DT's in the league! Also your brilliant use of a timeout FOR the Rams before halftime!

You know why nobody is ever disciplined for doing unforgivable crap on the field? Because MM seems to do stupid stuff all the freaking time, and nobody says or does anything. Helluva way to run a supposed professional football team!
Title: Re: Montgomery
Post by: PackerYakker on October 29, 2018, 09:43:11 PM
Montgomery is full of crap.

....he acknowledged the return unit had its usual conversation — “if it’s in the end zone, keep it in the end zone”

So, he admits that if the ball was in the endzone, he was supposed to down it.

“At that point in time, I stood where I always stood, I had a returnable ball,” he said. “So I made a split-second decision, I don’t know if this is going to land on the goal line. So I’m not going to take a knee on the goal line, at the half-yard line and take a chance at putting the game in the ref's hands."

This make no sense. He might not have known if the ball was going to land on the goal line while it was in the air, but that obviously changes the instant he catches the ball. He secured it six feet behind the goal line. It wasn't close. A fraction of second to check where his feet were and he would've known he wasn't yet in the field of play.

He never concedes that he made the wrong decision. Instead he deflects with some bogus hypothetical. And of course the GBP writer doesn't call him on it.
He obviously ignored the coaching directive to down it. And now he's the victim.
Title: Re: Montgomery
Post by: Whiskey Sam on October 30, 2018, 06:45:42 AM
Yep, he should be cut. If they won't cut him, MM should bench him. If neither happens, they have lost control of this team.

If cut he might be picked up by another team just to pick his brain about the Packer's x and o's. On the top of that list might be NE!

So no one should ever cut any player ever? Teams already have film, and we've been running the same plays forever.
Title: Re: Montgomery
Post by: Whiskey Sam on October 30, 2018, 06:50:06 AM
Montgomery is full of crap.

....he acknowledged the return unit had its usual conversation — “if it’s in the end zone, keep it in the end zone”

So, he admits that if the ball was in the endzone, he was supposed to down it.

“At that point in time, I stood where I always stood, I had a returnable ball,” he said. “So I made a split-second decision, I don’t know if this is going to land on the goal line. So I’m not going to take a knee on the goal line, at the half-yard line and take a chance at putting the game in the ref's hands."

This make no sense. He might not have known if the ball was going to land on the goal line while it was in the air, but that obviously changes the instant he catches the ball. He secured it six feet behind the goal line. It wasn't close. A fraction of second to check where his feet were and he would've known he wasn't yet in the field of play.

He never concedes that he made the wrong decision. Instead he deflects with some bogus hypothetical. And of course the GBP writer doesn't call him on it.
He obviously ignored the coaching directive to down it. And now he's the victim.

It's even worse with the rule change this year. Why was he in the end zone at all? If the ball touches in the end zone, it's instantly dead. He should have been standing with his heels on the goal line. If the ball is over his head, don't touch it. The Bills did this all night last night. There was zero reason for him to touch the football at all in the end zone if he wasn't supposed to be returning it. I'm not buying his story.
Title: Re: Montgomery
Post by: PackerJoe on October 30, 2018, 09:06:16 AM
First of all he's not a kid, he is a veteran.  Even if a coach didn't tell him anything, veterans don't make stupid mistakes.  I wanted him traded at the beginning of the year for a 3/4th pick.  Will be lucky to get a 7th.  We can send him to Oakland along with a 6th rd pick for Bruce Irvine!!!!

THERE IS NO EXCUSE FOR BEING STUPID!
Title: Re: Montgomery
Post by: WTX_Cheese on October 30, 2018, 09:08:02 AM
I don't think you cut Monty. He COULD be a valuable pass catcher out of the backfield if MM would ever use him.

He made a bad, really dumb mistake, but it happens.
Title: Re: Montgomery
Post by: skcusICH on October 30, 2018, 09:08:29 AM
I thought this was a good read by ESPN. Seems like some sincere honesty by a couple of players and coach. Some rare honesty in interviews.

http://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/25121037/packers-ty-montgomery-admits-return-was-mistake

I kind of nodded my head in agreement when Ty referenced his position switch and the potential impact that had on his NFL career. That's probably a great example of not being a selfish player.

Unfortunate the way everything unfolded with that kickoff. It stung hard, to both players and fans.
Title: Re: Montgomery
Post by: Whiskey Sam on October 30, 2018, 09:41:55 AM
I thought this was a good read by ESPN. Seems like some sincere honesty by a couple of players and coach. Some rare honesty in interviews.

http://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/25121037/packers-ty-montgomery-admits-return-was-mistake

I kind of nodded my head in agreement when Ty referenced his position switch and the potential impact that had on his NFL career. That's probably a great example of not being a selfish player.

Unfortunate the way everything unfolded with that kickoff. It stung hard, to both players and fans.

His explanation still makes no sense. Why was he in the end zone fielding the kick in the first place? If they didn't want to bring out any kick in the end zone, he should have had his heels on the goal line. Anything over his head is an instant touchback the moment it lands in the end zone in that case. No need to guess if it's short or not.
Title: Re: Montgomery
Post by: ricky on October 30, 2018, 10:29:35 AM
I don't think you cut Monty. He COULD be a valuable pass catcher out of the backfield if MM would ever use him.


True. And Aaron Jones could be a consistent 100 yard rusher if MM kept him on the field. But he won't and he doesn't. Whether it is being stubborn, or too egotistical, or simply he doesn't believe in these players, but he doesn't use them to their maximum effectiveness. So, to my mind, cut Montgomery to send a message, and let MM go at the end of the season so someone else can utilize these guys to their full potential.
Title: Re: Montgomery
Post by: ricky on October 30, 2018, 10:32:49 AM
His explanation still makes no sense. Why was he in the end zone fielding the kick in the first place? If they didn't want to bring out any kick in the end zone, he should have had his heels on the goal line. Anything over his head is an instant touchback the moment it lands in the end zone in that case. No need to guess if it's short or not.

And if the ball lands on the goal line and goes sideways, staying inbounds, or bounces backward into play? I know, the odds are astronomical, but so was the Pats win in the SB over the Falcons, and so were the odds of Minny beating NO on a last second TD. So, the Packers had the right idea; Montgomery apparently thought he knew better. Just like Bostick did, and with similar results.
Title: Re: Montgomery
Post by: packdaddy on October 30, 2018, 10:51:22 AM
CNN.com has a link on their homepage that reads: Are the Packers on the verge of collapse?

Is this just so much click-bate on CNN's part, or is there actually a problem that manifests itself in things like the Montgomery mutiny?

This isn't going away, nor can it be swept under the rug, as is the Packers' tendency. 
Title: Re: Montgomery
Post by: Whiskey Sam on October 30, 2018, 11:44:22 AM
His explanation still makes no sense. Why was he in the end zone fielding the kick in the first place? If they didn't want to bring out any kick in the end zone, he should have had his heels on the goal line. Anything over his head is an instant touchback the moment it lands in the end zone in that case. No need to guess if it's short or not.

And if the ball lands on the goal line and goes sideways, staying inbounds, or bounces backward into play? I know, the odds are astronomical, but so was the Pats win in the SB over the Falcons, and so were the odds of Minny beating NO on a last second TD. So, the Packers had the right idea; Montgomery apparently thought he knew better. Just like Bostick did, and with similar results.

If the ball lands on the goal line, it's a touchback and a dead ball. It is by definition not going over his head if he has his heels on the goal line. This isn't that difficult. Montgomery should not have been in the end zone at all attempting to field the kick. There is no reason to be in the end zone with the new rule this year if you want to take the touchback automatically. The new rule states: The ball is dead if it is not touched by the receiving team and touches the ground in the end zone (touchback). The Bills did this all night on Monday night letting kick after kick go unfielded for touchbacks that landed in the end zone on kickoffs.
Title: Re: Montgomery
Post by: The GM on October 30, 2018, 12:50:30 PM
Monty traded to Balt for a 2020 7th rounder.