June 24, 2018, 03:32:46 PM

Author Topic: Brian Gutekunst new Packers GM  (Read 4011 times)

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Offline RT

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Re: Brian Gutekunst new Packers GM
« Reply #45 on: January 13, 2018, 08:16:01 AM »
I'm really anticipating this off-season to see exactly how aggressive Gutekunst is in player acquisition.

I think the part of the fanbase that has the 'sign everyone in free agency mentality' are going to be disappointed. Would be surprised if their is much difference in the way business is conducted. All the fantasy football guru managers who felt suppressed by TT's slow and steady approach will probably continue to feel suppressed.

Offline The GM

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Re: Brian Gutekunst new Packers GM
« Reply #46 on: January 13, 2018, 09:34:19 AM »
I'm really anticipating this off-season to see exactly how aggressive Gutekunst is in player acquisition.

It will be interesting.  Im not expecting much change since TT is still a "Senior Advisor", and you have to be smart with the cap.   I'll be more interested in seeing his approach to trades.  In previous years, TT reportedly wouldn't give up draft choices for  Marshawn Lynch (Buffalo), Randy Moss (Oakland)  or Tony Gonzalez (KC).  Would Gute make those trades???   Dont know. 

One thing people forget is how hard it is to get FA's to Green Bay.  Its certainly not a paradise for many players and is among the bottem 3-4 places for FAs to come to.  There are normally 3 conditions for big name free agents to come to Green Bay. 

1.  You have to overpay them (Reggie White, signed the largest defensive player contract in history to come to Green Bay.  Peppers was paid VERY well too)
2.  There's no market for them (Nobody wanted Charles Woodson except Tampa Bay who wanted him to play safety, he didn't want to play safety)
3.  You are on the brink of a Super Bowl, and players are looking for a ring.

Gute may be interested in being aggressive in FA, but reality may be a different ballgame.  I think TT's lack of interest in FA, had a lot to do with overpaying players to come to Green Bay.  It is my belief that Green Bay was often used by agents to drive up prices for their clients (Chris Canty).   Gute may have a different approach to this, but its pretty tough to get someone to come to Green Bay if the money is the same elsewhere.  The players and importantly their families can lay on the beach in Miami, or Tampa, or Jacksonville, or San Diego vs spending that time in Green Bay.    If the money is the same, it can be a tough sell, and you have to keep your salary cap in mind.   If I have to spend more for FA's than other teams, it leaves less than other teams to fill my team,  my team suffers.   That's why I think TT didn't get involved in FA.   I wish he would have, but I understand his approach.  Gute may tackle this differently.  We'll see.   

Online craig

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Re: Brian Gutekunst new Packers GM
« Reply #47 on: January 13, 2018, 11:07:21 AM »
Those are great points, GM.  And I think with the Packers coming off a losing season, with Rodgers getting old, I'm not sure that the lure of winning, or the perception of the Packers being one of the very, very best teams with a great shot at the SB, is as strong as it was.  A lot of teams can probably hope and make the case that they've got a legit shot to win.  Yes, Rodgers does give a shot, and not all teams have that; but Green Bay isn't like 5 years ago, or like New England or whatever. 

1.  One draw for a FA would be to play with Rodgers.  In past, FA always focused on defense.  But we need TE and could surely use a WR.  For WR/TE, I'd think the chance to play with Rodgers would appeal.

2.  RT mentions probably things being not much different.  T/F, depending on reference.  I'm not expecting big-ticket FA, much less plural.  But I'm imagining perhaps something more like last winter.  Bennett, House, Evans, Kendricks, those were four FA's signed, with no threat to cap.  Those guys combined for what, maybe $12 or so in cap space?  Relative to $178 cap, the common perspective that FA activity is really risky cap-wise wasn't true at all.  Then they added Dial and the San Fran OLB as well, so they added six low-price vets. Of the main four they signed, three (Evans, House, Bennett) were signed and used in starting roles; to add three FA-starters is kind of a major activity. 

I'm not really expecting Gute to sign that many guys, I don't think three starters plus three regular rotation guys will ever be an average winter.  But I think that's the type of involvement that Gute is going to be interested in.  Not signing some star who's going to cost like Adams did, but a TE who's more within the Bennett-Kendricks brackets, etc.. 

TT had many years where the only FA's added were minimum-wage guys who got cut in camp.  So I don't expect Gute to be that inactive, even if he's not going to annually be adding six FA's including 3 starters. 

3.  One factor in FA that GM didn't mention is opportunity.  Some $$ FA's are going to be starters anywhere.  But some are more like House or Evans or Kendricks:  guys who might not have a starting role or any role at all for a lot of other rosters.  5-6 years ago, I often felt like TT had a roster where intended starters were pretty well defined, and he'd already drafted ahead so that hypotetcally a high-round draft pick was already on the roster when a vet was done.  (Mike Neil was supposed to take Cullen Jenkins spot; Bulaga for Tauscher; WR to replace Jennings and Driver....)  At present I don't see the Packers roster as having that kind of strength and depth.  So, a guy who hasn't been a starter and wants that chance, could get that at tE.  Or OG, or OT.  A WR could very easily emerge as #3 guy.  A corner might pretty easily win out as a starter, or as a regular guy in nickle.  So, I think Gute really does have the chance to sell career-opportunity to some FA's. 

4.  The other Q with FA is, how do you pursue it?  Before the GM hiring was decided, I'd seen a lengty, in-depth article on Ball.  It had lots of other info, but re FA it suggested that FA was all Ball, TT wasn't involved in negotiations at all, and maybe not MM either.  That all negotiating was done strictly with agent, they never talk to the players.  And that Ball was kind of meticulous and perhaps a little bit slow-moving, relative to some other clubs.  (That's the impression I got from statements by un-named agents in the MJS story.)  My question with Gute is, will he involve himself?  Or get himself and MM involved?  Some GM's, and sometimes coaches too, are very active salesmen and recruitors.  I believe Theo Epstein with the Cubs is really gifted at this, and I think the Cubs have Theo (pres), Hoyer (GM), and Maddon (manager) all visit and talk with a player himself, not just with his agent.  They say that's really important for them:  do I really like this guy, is he smart, will he fit in, is he about winning or selfish, will he stay motivated, etc..  And it's important for the player, to meet the bosses and get familiar with the team and facilities that he'll potentially be a part of; and perhaps to be persuaded that if he joins he can contribute to, enjoy, and help enable a championship. 

I mention that because Gute comes across as a really warm, nice, positive, trust-worthy, sincere guy, really likable.  I wonder if Packers would consider revising their approach.  If there's a guy you're interested in, have Gute talk to him, have MM talk to him, have Rodgers recruiting him, having position coach and position-group guys texting and recruiting him.  Make a guy feel loved and wanted, not just Ball interacting with the agent?
 

Offline Kepler

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Re: Brian Gutekunst new Packers GM
« Reply #48 on: January 13, 2018, 11:11:11 AM »
Those are good points that actually may favor an approach towards trading because it takes most of the options out of a players hands.

Offline TAYLORBOY

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Re: Brian Gutekunst new Packers GM
« Reply #49 on: January 13, 2018, 07:28:02 PM »
A big change that also would  help is lower level trades and mid level FA's instead of signing so many UDFA

Players with some experience and backup talent in place of the very green rookie

Offline Donzo

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Re: Brian Gutekunst new Packers GM
« Reply #50 on: January 14, 2018, 05:43:12 AM »
I think TT's lack of interest in FA, had a lot to do with overpaying players to come to Green Bay.


That hasn't been a thing for a long time, if it ever really was...

If anything, we've heard that the Packers haven't been interested in players interested in playing for the Packers.

The times are a changing, though... Gute will be looking to add free agents, we'll see how it plays out.

Offline The GM

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Re: Brian Gutekunst new Packers GM
« Reply #51 on: January 14, 2018, 07:49:03 AM »
I think TT's lack of interest in FA, had a lot to do with overpaying players to come to Green Bay.


That hasn't been a thing for a long time, if it ever really was...

If anything, we've heard that the Packers haven't been interested in players interested in playing for the Packers.

The times are a changing, though... Gute will be looking to add free agents, we'll see how it plays out.
Of course everyone is interested in playing for the Packers in the negotiating process, but things change when it comes to signing.  Green Bay can be a tough place to sell in FA.

Offline dannobanano

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Re: Brian Gutekunst new Packers GM
« Reply #52 on: January 14, 2018, 08:25:49 AM »
Players I'd like to see Gute try to target in free agency are:

TE - Trey Burton (Philly)

WR - Taylor Gabriel (ATL)

CB - Davon House (I think he'd come back on the cheap again. His 2017 injuries leave him with little market value), or DJ Hayden (DET), or Marcus Williams/RFA (HOU).


I think these players would be signings that would not require block-buster deals and would fit with GB's free agent signing philosophy.

Offline Leader

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Re: Brian Gutekunst new Packers GM
« Reply #53 on: January 14, 2018, 08:47:15 AM »
Players I'd like to see Gute try to target in free agency are:

TE - Trey Burton (Philly)

WR - Taylor Gabriel (ATL)

CB - Davon House (I think he'd come back on the cheap again. His 2017 injuries leave him with little market value), or DJ Hayden (DET), or Marcus Williams/RFA (HOU).


I think these players would be signings that would not require block-buster deals and would fit with GB's free agent signing philosophy.


I like the Gabriel possibility. He's got some quicks - but actually wondering whats up with Burton? He's honestly not hit my radar screen (which means next to nothing......) but I was thinking more of a guy like Luke Wilson of SEA. They're similar ages - Wilson's bigger and has better career stats. Which do you feel would bring better bang for the buck?
Whats Burton's game? Is he fast for a TE? I'll have to focus in on him in these playoffs.

Offline The GM

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Re: Brian Gutekunst new Packers GM
« Reply #54 on: January 14, 2018, 09:45:12 AM »
Players I'd like to see Gute try to target in free agency are:

TE - Trey Burton (Philly)

WR - Taylor Gabriel (ATL)

CB - Davon House (I think he'd come back on the cheap again. His 2017 injuries leave him with little market value), or DJ Hayden (DET), or Marcus Williams/RFA (HOU).


I think these players would be signings that would not require block-buster deals and would fit with GB's free agent signing philosophy.


I like the Gabriel possibility. He's got some quicks - but actually wondering whats up with Burton? He's honestly not hit my radar screen (which means next to nothing......) but I was thinking more of a guy like Luke Wilson of SEA. They're similar ages - Wilson's bigger and has better career stats. Which do you feel would bring better bang for the buck?
Whats Burton's game? Is he fast for a TE? I'll have to focus in on him in these playoffs.


Willson (Two L's)  they make a big deal of two L's in Seattle to separate him from Russell Wilson, lol).   Good call, hes a sneaky TE.  No sure how good he is in traffic, but  when they go to him, he's often wide open.   One of those guys you overlook but at the end of the day, his catches kills you.  Good football player.  Seattle will keep one of their tight ends either Jimmy Graham or Willson.   Graham is making 10 million, he had a good year in his contract year, but doesnt block worth a crap.  It wouldnt surprise me for them to let Graham go and keep Willson.       

Offline dannobanano

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Re: Brian Gutekunst new Packers GM
« Reply #55 on: January 14, 2018, 11:01:36 AM »
Players I'd like to see Gute try to target in free agency are:

TE - Trey Burton (Philly)

WR - Taylor Gabriel (ATL)

CB - Davon House (I think he'd come back on the cheap again. His 2017 injuries leave him with little market value), or DJ Hayden (DET), or Marcus Williams/RFA (HOU).


I think these players would be signings that would not require block-buster deals and would fit with GB's free agent signing philosophy.


I like the Gabriel possibility. He's got some quicks - but actually wondering whats up with Burton? He's honestly not hit my radar screen (which means next to nothing......) but I was thinking more of a guy like Luke Wilson of SEA. They're similar ages - Wilson's bigger and has better career stats. Which do you feel would bring better bang for the buck?
Whats Burton's game? Is he fast for a TE? I'll have to focus in on him in these playoffs.

Burton, age 26, (6-3/235) has a 40 time of 4.62 and is the #3 TE, behind Ertz and Celek, and hasn't gotten a ton of playing time, but I watched him in weeks #13-14-15, while Ertz was out with an injury, and he put up good numbers (4/42, 5/71/2TD's, 2/15/1 TD).

For the season he has 23 receptions, 248 yds, 5 TD's.

By comparison, Luke Willson, age 27, (6-5/254) has a 40 time of 4.57, and has 15 receptions, 153 yds, 4 TD's.

I just think that there will be less suitors for Burton and his cost will be less than Willson.

Either way, I've got no qualms.

Online ricky

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Re: Brian Gutekunst new Packers GM
« Reply #56 on: January 17, 2018, 07:51:51 AM »
From PFT, an article on Gutekunst, how he became a part of the Packers (kinda funny), and some indications we could indeed see some new approaches to building a team: https://www.jsonline.com/story/sports/nfl/packers/2018/01/16/brian-gutekunst-his-own-man-packers-gm/1037358001/
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