August 24, 2019, 04:04:24 AM

Author Topic: 2019 draft tidbits  (Read 4155 times)

0 Members and 2 Guests are viewing this topic.

Offline dannobanano

  • HOF Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 5231
  • Karma: +40/-2
Re: 2019 draft tidbits
« Reply #15 on: March 22, 2019, 04:48:42 PM »
RT - White is a bully. Understand where you are coming from though. It would seem to me that an ideal fit for Pettine's defense would be Tre Lamar from Clemson. Really hope he ends up a Packer.

White is a fine player.

The obsession is strong with some on this board to draft a ILB high in the draft. (Not pointing at you, footballdad) If they do I will pull for them to be a big part in the success of the team, but the history of the Wolf/Thompson front office tree and Pettine's time as a DC and HC suggest that the Packers are not going to invest a high pick in that position. Pettine's defense is all about DLineman and cover corners and that is where the high draft capital has always went in support of him.

I guess with many fan(atic)s being rational in thought when it comes to their teams decisions is not in their DNA. If team history and behavioral patterns are studied, we as fans can get a good idea on the moves that may well be made. A clear and open mind is a good starting point in achieving that understanding.   

Germaine Pratt/NC St. - 4th round?

Offline RT

  • HOF Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3494
  • Karma: +60/-17
Re: 2019 draft tidbits
« Reply #16 on: March 22, 2019, 06:02:37 PM »
Interesting guy danno. Former safety who grew into a LB. Has good speed and some cover skills, but only started one game in his college career and is still a bit raw to the position. Their pro day is the 29th and I hope he does the short area drills there, he did not do them at the combine. One to keep an eye on.

Here are 4 that seem to be matches,

Ty Summers - TCU   
Bobby Okereke - Stanford
Blake Cashman - Minnesota
Drue Tranquill - Notre Dame

And 4 that are off by a fraction somewhere and worth double checking their Pro days,

Ben Burr-Kirven - Washington
Jahlani Tavai - Hawaii
Cody Barton - Utah
Ryan Connelly - Wisconsin

I should add Cameron Smith from USC to this list of players to check their pro days.
« Last Edit: March 22, 2019, 06:05:57 PM by RT »

Offline dannobanano

  • HOF Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 5231
  • Karma: +40/-2
Re: 2019 draft tidbits
« Reply #17 on: March 22, 2019, 07:35:35 PM »
 thumbsup) on Burr-Kirven. I’ve been keeping an eye on him as well.

Offline RT

  • HOF Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3494
  • Karma: +60/-17
Re: 2019 draft tidbits
« Reply #18 on: March 23, 2019, 09:57:19 AM »
thumbsup) on Burr-Kirven. I’ve been keeping an eye on him as well.

The only disqualifier for him danno in that he weighed in at 230 at the combine. Now that alone very well may be a complete deal breaker in the Packers eyes and put him off their board, but he is still only 21 years old and the Packers may view him as a player with some growth yet to come. The Packers do have a history of drafting some very young guys. His physical testing at the combine was top shelf stuff. His 3-cone was 6.85 which was 1st among all LB's, his short shuttle was 4.09 which was 3rd. 21 reps on the bench and a 4.56/40 are all very good numbers.

To compare,

Devin White - 3-cone 7.07, short shuttle 4.17, 22 reps on the bench, 4.42/40

Devin Bush - 3-cone 6.93, short shuttle 4.23, 21 reps on the bench, 4.43/40

Fans get hung up on 40 times, but they are the least important numbers of all these. What is a wiser move for the Packers, use a 1st round pick on White or Bush? Or a 4th on a player like Burr-Kirven?     

Offline dannobanano

  • HOF Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 5231
  • Karma: +40/-2
Re: 2019 draft tidbits
« Reply #19 on: March 23, 2019, 10:44:49 AM »
thumbsup) on Burr-Kirven. I’ve been keeping an eye on him as well.

The only disqualifier for him danno in that he weighed in at 230 at the combine. Now that alone very well may be a complete deal breaker in the Packers eyes and put him off their board, but he is still only 21 years old and the Packers may view him as a player with some growth yet to come. The Packers do have a history of drafting some very young guys. His physical testing at the combine was top shelf stuff. His 3-cone was 6.85 which was 1st among all LB's, his short shuttle was 4.09 which was 3rd. 21 reps on the bench and a 4.56/40 are all very good numbers.

To compare,

Devin White - 3-cone 7.07, short shuttle 4.17, 22 reps on the bench, 4.42/40

Devin Bush - 3-cone 6.93, short shuttle 4.23, 21 reps on the bench, 4.43/40

Fans get hung up on 40 times, but they are the least important numbers of all these. What is a wiser move for the Packers, use a 1st round pick on White or Bush? Or a 4th on a player like Burr-Kirven?   

Change of direction and short area quickness is paramount for the position, and he's has the goods in those qualities.

I would view him as more of an off-the-ball defender at LB with the ability to be an upgrade of covering RB's and TE's.

Offline OneTwoSixFive

  • HOF Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2364
  • Karma: +15/-10
Re: 2019 draft tidbits
« Reply #20 on: March 24, 2019, 01:52:49 AM »
thumbsup) on Burr-Kirven. I’ve been keeping an eye on him as well.

...........or USC's ILB Cameron Smith. The Packers are strongly influenced by heady ILBs (both Ryan and Martinez were among the most instinctive in their draft years. Smith is another guy in that mold.
(ricky) "Personally, I'm putting this in a box, driving a stake through its heart, firing a silver bullet into its (empty) head, nailing it shut, loading it into a rocket and firing it into the sun. "

(Pink Floyd) "Set the controls for the heart of the sun"

Offline The GM

  • HOF Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2768
  • Karma: +48/-4
Re: 2019 draft tidbits
« Reply #21 on: March 24, 2019, 04:25:36 PM »
thumbsup) on Burr-Kirven. I’ve been keeping an eye on him as well.

The only disqualifier for him danno in that he weighed in at 230 at the combine. Now that alone very well may be a complete deal breaker in the Packers eyes and put him off their board, but he is still only 21 years old and the Packers may view him as a player with some growth yet to come. The Packers do have a history of drafting some very young guys. His physical testing at the combine was top shelf stuff. His 3-cone was 6.85 which was 1st among all LB's, his short shuttle was 4.09 which was 3rd. 21 reps on the bench and a 4.56/40 are all very good numbers.


I've watched him extensively for the past 3 seasons.  Dozens of times in person.  Kid is a football player, VERY instinctive.   He's a tackling machine who led the nation in tackles and was the PAC12 DPOY.   Like RT said he a little small, but is always around the ball.  Very active. He reminds me of a smaller Blake Martinez, but is a better athlete IMO.  Not sure how his size will translate to the next level.  As a pure football player, the kid can play.   I'd take a flyer on him, he will help. at worse, he'll be a special teams demon.   He made a lot of big plays for Washington over the years.    If you can put a few pounds on him, somebody will get a very, very good football player.   

Offline #66

  • HOF Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 616
  • Karma: +8/-1
Re: 2019 draft tidbits
« Reply #22 on: March 26, 2019, 04:53:19 PM »
As I have posted elsewhere, Pettine's D has always featured a true "chase" linebacker when his D is at it's best.  I think that there is still some thought that this could either be Burks or Jones.  The addition of Amos greatly increases the liklihood of seeing Jones playing much closer to the LOS and as an overhang defender.  His best game was against Cincy, if I remember right, and he was lining up close to the ball most of the time that game.

That being said, Gutey's FA pickups are going to allow him to go just about anywhere with these picks.  After last year's draft it is clear that he is looking to add speed.
The difference between a successful person and others is not a lack of strength, not a lack of knowledge, but rather a lack of will. - Vince Lombardi

Offline RT

  • HOF Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3494
  • Karma: +60/-17
Re: 2019 draft tidbits
« Reply #23 on: March 26, 2019, 07:01:23 PM »
As I have posted elsewhere, Pettine's D has always featured a true "chase" linebacker when his D is at it's best.  I think that there is still some thought that this could either be Burks or Jones.  The addition of Amos greatly increases the liklihood of seeing Jones playing much closer to the LOS and as an overhang defender.  His best game was against Cincy, if I remember right, and he was lining up close to the ball most of the time that game.

That being said, Gutey's FA pickups are going to allow him to go just about anywhere with these picks.  After last year's draft it is clear that he is looking to add speed.

Not trying to throw rocks at your house 66, but I just don't think your "chase" linebacker theory is correct. When Pettine was the DC for the Jets from '09-'12, all 4 years the 2 ILB's were David Harris and Bart Scott. Both veteran thumpers who were assignment sure, but not the most gifted of athletes. Just don't think anyone ever would call either a "chase" type LB. His one season in Buffalo as DC his ILB's were Arthur Moats (another plugger) and rookie Kiko Alonso. Alonso did have his best season as a rookie and could be called a "chase" LB I guess, but I think his game was more physical than chase. As the HC in Cleveland they signed a 33 year old Karlo Dansby (certainly not a chase type LB) and he was there both of Pettine's seasons. The second spot along side Dansby was somewhat a revolving door, but marginal players like Craig Robertson and Christian Kirksley had most of the starts.

This may well be the year that the Packers draft such a LB, but it's not because of a history of such a player in Pettine's defenses. IMO 

Offline RT

  • HOF Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3494
  • Karma: +60/-17
Re: 2019 draft tidbits
« Reply #24 on: March 27, 2019, 09:06:18 AM »

Tom Pelissero

Verified account
 
@TomPelissero
Follow
Follow @TomPelissero
 
More
Mississippi State edge Montez Sweat told me he’s met with the #Panthers, #Eagles and #Dolphins here ... first visit this weekend with the #Bucs, then the #Bills, #Packers, #Raiders, #49ers, others to follow. Teams had him do a few coverage drops today, too.

Offline RT

  • HOF Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3494
  • Karma: +60/-17
Re: 2019 draft tidbits
« Reply #25 on: March 27, 2019, 09:08:49 AM »

Josh Norris

Verified account
 
@JoshNorris
Follow
Follow @JoshNorris
 
More
Josh Norris Retweeted Graham Hall

Looks like we won't be getting an athletic profile for Jachai Polite. Ran the forty and now being attended to.

No shuttle or 3-cone.

Offline #66

  • HOF Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 616
  • Karma: +8/-1
Re: 2019 draft tidbits
« Reply #26 on: March 28, 2019, 07:49:26 AM »
As I have posted elsewhere, Pettine's D has always featured a true "chase" linebacker when his D is at it's best.  I think that there is still some thought that this could either be Burks or Jones.  The addition of Amos greatly increases the liklihood of seeing Jones playing much closer to the LOS and as an overhang defender.  His best game was against Cincy, if I remember right, and he was lining up close to the ball most of the time that game.

That being said, Gutey's FA pickups are going to allow him to go just about anywhere with these picks.  After last year's draft it is clear that he is looking to add speed.

Not trying to throw rocks at your house 66, but I just don't think your "chase" linebacker theory is correct. When Pettine was the DC for the Jets from '09-'12, all 4 years the 2 ILB's were David Harris and Bart Scott. Both veteran thumpers who were assignment sure, but not the most gifted of athletes. Just don't think anyone ever would call either a "chase" type LB. His one season in Buffalo as DC his ILB's were Arthur Moats (another plugger) and rookie Kiko Alonso. Alonso did have his best season as a rookie and could be called a "chase" LB I guess, but I think his game was more physical than chase. As the HC in Cleveland they signed a 33 year old Karlo Dansby (certainly not a chase type LB) and he was there both of Pettine's seasons. The second spot along side Dansby was somewhat a revolving door, but marginal players like Craig Robertson and Christian Kirksley had most of the starts.

This may well be the year that the Packers draft such a LB, but it's not because of a history of such a player in Pettine's defenses. IMO
That NYJ D was very unique in that it had, arguably, one of the best sets of CBs in the history of modern football.  I think that helped mitigate the fact somewhat.  Last night I was looking, unsuccessfully, for the quote that included Pettine talking about the role of the "chase" LB in his system.  My argument was not that the player had to have a big name but that he was able to track across the field.  Scott did, actually, play with decent speed and Harris received a decent contract midway through Pettine's tenure there if I remember correctly in large part because he was making tackles all over the field.

Now, one could certainly argue that the prominent roles played by the DL in his system allow those ILBs to play much more clean and therefore react more quickly to targets coming out of the backfield and slot.  I would wholeheartedly agree with this.

I do believe that improved ILB play is imperative for GB.  I am just positing the thought that it may not come from a high draft pick but rather from someone already on the roster.  I also believe that there will be a pick at ILB at some point in the draft.  GB must not only try to improve the group but also prepare for the impending FA of Martinez who has yet to receive a more lucrative payday and certainly wants one in what will be his first high dollar contract.
The difference between a successful person and others is not a lack of strength, not a lack of knowledge, but rather a lack of will. - Vince Lombardi

Offline RT

  • HOF Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3494
  • Karma: +60/-17
Re: 2019 draft tidbits
« Reply #27 on: March 28, 2019, 08:21:59 AM »
As I have posted elsewhere, Pettine's D has always featured a true "chase" linebacker when his D is at it's best.  I think that there is still some thought that this could either be Burks or Jones.  The addition of Amos greatly increases the liklihood of seeing Jones playing much closer to the LOS and as an overhang defender.  His best game was against Cincy, if I remember right, and he was lining up close to the ball most of the time that game.

That being said, Gutey's FA pickups are going to allow him to go just about anywhere with these picks.  After last year's draft it is clear that he is looking to add speed.

Not trying to throw rocks at your house 66, but I just don't think your "chase" linebacker theory is correct. When Pettine was the DC for the Jets from '09-'12, all 4 years the 2 ILB's were David Harris and Bart Scott. Both veteran thumpers who were assignment sure, but not the most gifted of athletes. Just don't think anyone ever would call either a "chase" type LB. His one season in Buffalo as DC his ILB's were Arthur Moats (another plugger) and rookie Kiko Alonso. Alonso did have his best season as a rookie and could be called a "chase" LB I guess, but I think his game was more physical than chase. As the HC in Cleveland they signed a 33 year old Karlo Dansby (certainly not a chase type LB) and he was there both of Pettine's seasons. The second spot along side Dansby was somewhat a revolving door, but marginal players like Craig Robertson and Christian Kirksley had most of the starts.

This may well be the year that the Packers draft such a LB, but it's not because of a history of such a player in Pettine's defenses. IMO
That NYJ D was very unique in that it had, arguably, one of the best sets of CBs in the history of modern football.  I think that helped mitigate the fact somewhat.  Last night I was looking, unsuccessfully, for the quote that included Pettine talking about the role of the "chase" LB in his system.  My argument was not that the player had to have a big name but that he was able to track across the field.  Scott did, actually, play with decent speed and Harris received a decent contract midway through Pettine's tenure there if I remember correctly in large part because he was making tackles all over the field.

Now, one could certainly argue that the prominent roles played by the DL in his system allow those ILBs to play much more clean and therefore react more quickly to targets coming out of the backfield and slot.  I would wholeheartedly agree with this.

I do believe that improved ILB play is imperative for GB.  I am just positing the thought that it may not come from a high draft pick but rather from someone already on the roster.  I also believe that there will be a pick at ILB at some point in the draft.  GB must not only try to improve the group but also prepare for the impending FA of Martinez who has yet to receive a more lucrative payday and certainly wants one in what will be his first high dollar contract.

That is a really good posting.

I do believe that what they had it NY is Pettine's ideal. Elite cover corners and disruptive DLineman, ILB's that are heady, sure tacklers and keep them clean, stout edge players, safeties that are assignment sure. I agree that drafting an ILB is probably a fairly high likelihood because of the reason you gave, his contract is coming up and it was leaked by someone that him and his agent are looking for a big payday. I don't know if that happens in GB, but it is wise to have a plan B. As for Martinez, the thing that I wonder about is how he is viewed is a weak link. He is one of the best players on that defense. He was the top rated ILB in the NFC North last season by PPF, yet people obsess about getting rid of him. Don't get it. 
« Last Edit: March 28, 2019, 08:24:41 AM by RT »

Offline mancl

  • HOF Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 773
  • Karma: +8/-1

Offline RT

  • HOF Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3494
  • Karma: +60/-17
Re: 2019 draft tidbits
« Reply #29 on: May 20, 2019, 07:12:53 PM »
Just dropping this here for anyone interested in a good post draft story. Chris Ballard with the Colts is one of the really sharp GM's out there, the Colts future looks very bright under his direction.

https://www.si.com/nfl/2019/05/20/colts-2019-offseason-chris-ballard-chris-long-retirement-patrick-peterson-suspension-mmqb