April 18, 2019, 06:01:18 PM

Author Topic: Present needs / future needs  (Read 705 times)

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Offline footballdad

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Present needs / future needs
« on: April 08, 2019, 04:28:28 AM »
What is needed for 2019 to be a contender? If everyone were to stay healthy could they contend as is, adding nothing?
QB - No choice. If AR buys into whatever MLF is selling, it could be great. If not it will be a ssdd scenario.
OL - Adding Turner provides options here. Should be an upgrade over McCray. Can Spriggs step up? Bulaga's health? Best case - a little better than last year. Worst case, about the same as last year.
WR - New system. Everyone starting off on page 1. Expect MVS and ESB to step up. Someone has to take the slot. Allison or Kumerow?
TE - Tonyan would have to make strides. Graham and Lewis? They are what they are. Guess you ride them till the wheels fall off.
RB - Talent there. Depth and health?
KR - ????
K - Ok there.......for now
P - Solid
DL - Solid, barring injury.
ILB - Have one starter in Martinez. Burks? Don't know enough yet. Pretty much zero depth. Definate weak link.
OLB/Edge - No issues there.
CB - No immediate concerns. Veteran leadership in Williams. Budding star in Alexander. Jackson takes the next step much like our young wr. King? Will we ever really know?
S - Upgrade in Amos. Will JJ step up? Improved, but not there yet.

Overall, I see a possible wild card team if they stay healthy.
Taking into consideration that good health is never a given, age at some spots, and impending free agency in 2020.......I would like to see something roughly along these lines in the draft.

QB - If AR goes down they are screwed. Would not be opposed to exploring the possibility of trading for Rosen. Should not upset AR since if you can believe what was written prior to the 2018 draft, AR was mentoring Rosen. Talented guy on a rookie deal. If Arizona would take a 4th and 6th this year and a 2nd or 3rd next year, I'm in.
OL - Would like to see a versatile guy added. Risner, Bradbury, Sharping. Or a possible down the road starter at guard or tackle. Lindstrom or Dillard.
WR - Someone for the slot. Hardemon, Isabella. Renfrow? MH could also help on KR/PR. Would be my first choice.
TE - Need an upgrade. Would prefer two. Hockenson would be my first choice.  One or two out of TJ, Sternberger, Moreau, or Oliver.
RB - Henderson, Hill, or Love.
DL - Simmons - sit for a season and replace Daniels in 2020 or Wilkins, Tillery, Lawrence.
ILB - Bush, Pratt, Lamar, Burr-Kirven, Hodge. Would like to see two.
OLB/ Edge - Burns, Polite, Winovich, Ferrell.
CB - Late round sleeper - Jordan Brown.
S - Thornhill, Abram, Savage, Hooker.

Offline Hands

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Re: Present needs / future needs
« Reply #1 on: April 08, 2019, 06:40:00 AM »
I would think, but not sure, that Green Bay is looking at TE, SS, and OL, as the three positions that HAVE to be addressed. Now the talent doesn't line up exactly like that in the first round. Hockenson-yes, Williams-yes but no SS until the second round. So I think what we might see is a combo of DL/TE or OT/TE in the first round. I don't think White makes it to 12 nor does Oliver.

If they go Edge/OT or Edge/TE in the 1st round, then look at Abrams in the 2nd. Gutsy is going to take BPA at 12. I don't know if Hockenson is rated that high on their board, but suspect Williams from AL is in their top ten. So many good edge guys I just don't see them getting out of the first two rounds w/o one.

Another position is ILB that has to be addressed. White is too early and Bush falls between 12 and 30. A player to keep an eye on is Johnson from UT. I'm not a big fan but he played OLB last year and in the pros he's a 3-4 ILB type of LB. One wildcard I have heard about is the progress of Donnerson. They may feel he's an edge guy that can be rotated and they skip that spot until later rounds.
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Offline scoremore

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Re: Present needs / future needs
« Reply #2 on: April 08, 2019, 08:32:57 AM »
The more I look at the board if Hock is there at #12 think he'll be the pick.  He's the guy who would have the most impact in year 1.  Only guy who could upset this is if Oliver is still on the board as well.  Then it would be real interesting.  Don't think Oliver slides and we end up taking Hock.  Tillery at #30.  He'll likely still be there.  Depends on who falls but think this is the most likely scenario if the mocks I am seeing are close.

Offline #66

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Re: Present needs / future needs
« Reply #3 on: April 08, 2019, 11:01:09 AM »
The more I look at the board if Hock is there at #12 think he'll be the pick.  He's the guy who would have the most impact in year 1.  Only guy who could upset this is if Oliver is still on the board as well.  Then it would be real interesting.  Don't think Oliver slides and we end up taking Hock.  Tillery at #30.  He'll likely still be there.  Depends on who falls but think this is the most likely scenario if the mocks I am seeing are close.
Honestly hoping for Tillery in second.
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Offline RT

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Re: Present needs / future needs
« Reply #4 on: April 08, 2019, 12:21:32 PM »
The more I look at the board if Hock is there at #12 think he'll be the pick.  He's the guy who would have the most impact in year 1.  Only guy who could upset this is if Oliver is still on the board as well.  Then it would be real interesting.  Don't think Oliver slides and we end up taking Hock.  Tillery at #30.  He'll likely still be there.  Depends on who falls but think this is the most likely scenario if the mocks I am seeing are close.
Honestly hoping for Tillery in second.

IMO, I doubt Tillery makes it to #30.

Offline dannobanano

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Re: Present needs / future needs
« Reply #5 on: April 08, 2019, 01:33:35 PM »
The more I look at the board if Hock is there at #12 think he'll be the pick.  He's the guy who would have the most impact in year 1.  Only guy who could upset this is if Oliver is still on the board as well.  Then it would be real interesting.  Don't think Oliver slides and we end up taking Hock.  Tillery at #30.  He'll likely still be there.  Depends on who falls but think this is the most likely scenario if the mocks I am seeing are close.
Honestly hoping for Tillery in second.

IMO, I doubt Tillery makes it to #30.

Agree. Tillery could easily be gone before #30.

Also agree with score that Hock has a high probability of being the #12 pick, which could make either Lindstrom or Risner strong candidates for the #30.

Offline footballdad

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Re: Present needs / future needs
« Reply #6 on: April 09, 2019, 02:04:30 AM »
Agree on Tillery. Don't think he makes it to #30. If he does he would have to be a strong consideration. Hockenson - just went to five different draft sites, checking out the big boards. He was ranked 5,7,8,9, and 10. Packers pick 12. If he were to be there, he checks both boxes. BPA and need. If teams drafting before us are not completely stupid, both White and Oliver will be gone. They are the two guys I would take over TJ.

Offline Hands

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Re: Present needs / future needs
« Reply #7 on: April 09, 2019, 09:27:31 AM »
Tillery is rated late 1st round early 2nd round as a DT. I would think he could be a 5-tech in the 3-4. Lawrence from Clemson is rated right before him and is compared to Eddie Goldman of the Bears, but is strictly a DT.
If the Packers are staying at 30 and a TE has already been selected, Abrams/Tillery could be the pick. If a DL guy or OT been selected at 12 and the Packers stay at 30, see if a TE is worth that pick.

I like the Packer's options because their needs and the talent come together nicely this year.
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Offline RT

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Re: Present needs / future needs
« Reply #8 on: April 09, 2019, 09:39:46 AM »
Tillery is rated late 1st round early 2nd round as a DT. I would think he could be a 5-tech in the 3-4. Lawrence from Clemson is rated right before him and is compared to Eddie Goldman of the Bears, but is strictly a DT.
If the Packers are staying at 30 and a TE has already been selected, Abrams/Tillery could be the pick. If a DL guy or OT been selected at 12 and the Packers stay at 30, see if a TE is worth that pick.

I like the Packer's options because their needs and the talent come together nicely this year.

I know you have a source you trust deeply Hands, but is it not possible that a player may well have a much higher first round slotting with one team from another? Is it possible that first round boards may even have some different players on it based on offensive and defensive schemes? Or how one team may view a medical or personal issue different from another team?   

Offline RT

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Re: Present needs / future needs
« Reply #9 on: April 09, 2019, 10:08:30 AM »
This idea is going to make many uncomfortable to think about it, but Tillery very well could be in play at 12 for the Packers.

https://www.profootballfocus.com/news/draft-jerry-tillery-is-elite-top-10-prospect

Offline dannobanano

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Re: Present needs / future needs
« Reply #10 on: April 09, 2019, 10:19:32 AM »
This idea is going to make many uncomfortable to think about it, but Tillery very well could be in play at 12 for the Packers.

https://www.profootballfocus.com/news/draft-jerry-tillery-is-elite-top-10-prospect

Kind of eye-popping if I do say so!
Put him along side Clark and "Z" on passing downs, and watch the QB wet his pants.

I may have my "guy" at #12 in my mock, but I'm not so stupid to not understand that if a guy like Tillery, or Oliver get's taken at #12 that somehow the Packers are worse off. Difference makers, are difference makers............period.

I just want Gute to make this team into a monster and let MLF/Rodgers & Co. make it all work.

Offline Hands

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Re: Present needs / future needs
« Reply #11 on: April 09, 2019, 11:19:10 AM »
Tillery is rated late 1st round early 2nd round as a DT. I would think he could be a 5-tech in the 3-4. Lawrence from Clemson is rated right before him and is compared to Eddie Goldman of the Bears, but is strictly a DT.
If the Packers are staying at 30 and a TE has already been selected, Abrams/Tillery could be the pick. If a DL guy or OT been selected at 12 and the Packers stay at 30, see if a TE is worth that pick.

I like the Packer's options because their needs and the talent come together nicely this year.

I know you have a source you trust deeply Hands, but is it not possible that a player may well have a much higher first round slotting with one team from another? Is it possible that first round boards may even have some different players on it based on offensive and defensive schemes? Or how one team may view a medical or personal issue different from another team?

Absolutely boards change from team to team. Grades are based on player qualities and needs. Some things nobody but teams know and that is medical, and personality makeups. I have no idea how good Tillary is, but according to my guy he runs very hot and cold. He has a ton of extra-curriculum activities that questions his focus to football. I had no idea, but I started looking at the beginning of the draft at DEs for the Packers and he's a great prospect for that position. So one guy says he the 29th best graded prospect, and another 31 tells me he's a late 1st round guy and would fit nicely for a 3-4 team. So why isn't he higher? That's when you start digging for more info and his ability is better then his film, hence hot and cold play. If the Packers get him at 30...it would be a good fit. The best fit, I don't think so....but let's face it its all a roll of the dice. We can only comment on what he hear and see.   
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Online OneTwoSixFive

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Re: Present needs / future needs
« Reply #12 on: April 10, 2019, 06:11:39 AM »
It is easy to tie in need/value at the OT position at #12 or #30, anticipating the loss of Bulaga when his contract runs out at the end of 2019, and also preparing for a quality replacement in case of injury.

Same applies to TE. It is a need and it is a good year for TEs, so the Packers may have interest in guys like Fant, Hockenson, I.Smith, Sternberger, Warring, Oliver at various points in the draft. I don't see best value at #12 (though Gute might), but after that it is quite possible the Packers invest there.

Same with Safety, though I'd be more interested in Free Safety than Strong Safety. I want a guy who has the ability to play single high. Not many Safeties have the speed and instincts for this position, and those that do (like J.Johnson, Gardner-Johnson, Adderley, Thornhill, Savage) are in demand. I'd guess that the sweet spot for available Free Safeties is one of these three picks (#30, #44, #75).

The biggest confusion comes when you consider the DL position. The Packers have some high quality talent at the position already, and what look like solid role players as well. However, a quality DL who has good pass rush capability could be a very valuable addition (even moreso if Daniels isn't retained when his contract expires). It also matches up well in terms of talent, in this particular draft. I see guys like Wilkins and Oliver as potential targets at #12, and Simmons, Tillery, Dre'Mont Jones at #30 and #44. Khalen Saunders might be a target at #75 or #114, but his method of attack is all bullrush.

WRs is a very difficult evaluation. I can see arguments for and against spending an early pick there. which way the Packers go will depend on how the draft board falls and whether they have fallen in love with any of the prospects. They don't have much of a need for later round prospects, even though there should be value in the 4th and 5th at WR. The loss of Cobb might trigger drafting a slot receiver - Packers have shown plenty of interest in Isabella, for example, but he will be a 2nd round or 3rd round pick at the latest. They could snatch what they see as a bargain like N'Keal Harry early, at #44 (he might even be worth it at #30). Whether the Packers decide to spend one of the day 1 or 2 picks is partly influenced by what they think they can get this year from Equanimeous, Marquez and J'Mon. If you want to predict whether the Packers get a WR in the first two days, toss a coin in the air and call it, you'll be about as likely to get that right, as predicting a WR addition early(ish).......or not.

A position that WILL get an addition, one that is virtually never talked about, is RB. No question in my mind they add at least one, but imo it will be later in the draft (rounds 4-5). It IS possible I am wrong here and they get one earlier, because history shows LaFleur likes his run game............stay tuned.

Corner.............naah (well, maybe a developmental one, late). A combination of a bad draft year for them and not being a pressing need at this time suggest no early pick there, despite the mantra of "you can never have enough good corners".

ILB I don't think they invest here early (ie one of the Devin's). I do see a possible later pick between the3rd and 5th round like Germaine Pratt, T.J.Edwards, Cameron Smith and Tre Watson. The Packers value good mental processing highly at this position.
« Last Edit: April 10, 2019, 06:14:13 AM by OneTwoSixFive »
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Offline RT

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Re: Present needs / future needs
« Reply #13 on: April 10, 2019, 07:11:08 AM »
That is an excellent assessment, 1265. Spot on.

Offline dannobanano

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Re: Present needs / future needs
« Reply #14 on: April 10, 2019, 07:32:47 AM »
Yes.
Very well written! Thanks, onetwosixfive!

A couple a late round/UFDA RB’s that could fit MLF’s offense are Tony Pollard of Memphis and Craig Reynolds of Kutztown.

Gute May take a late round flyer (6th-7th) on LB Kaden Ellis/Idaho, and let Pettine play him at ILB. The kid can cover in the passing game and has the ability to blitz. I went and looked at what film I could find on him and was impressed. Also read that 12 scouts(including Green Bay) were at his pro day and GB brought him in for a visit. So there seems to be interest.