June 16, 2019, 12:22:35 PM

Author Topic: Position look: WR  (Read 1213 times)

0 Members and 3 Guests are viewing this topic.

Offline dannobanano

  • HOF Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 5133
  • Karma: +38/-2
Re: Position look: WR
« Reply #15 on: May 21, 2019, 02:51:40 PM »
#1) All receivers (WR and TE) are expected to learn the formations first.
#2) All receivers are then expected to learn the route tree off of each formation.

A couple examples of what to expect:

https://cheeseheadtv.com/blog/film-study-lafleurs-play-action-rollout-419

https://cheeseheadtv.com/blog/film-study-lafleurs-playbook-swing-pass-207


And just a footnote on Trevor Davis.

https://cheeseheadtv.com/blog/no-receivers-seat-is-hotter-than-trevor-davis-711

Offline B

  • HOF Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4257
  • Karma: +15/-8
Re: Position look: WR
« Reply #16 on: May 21, 2019, 04:15:28 PM »
I don't put much stock in OTA lineups, but with Adams not practicing Geronimo Allison and Marquez Valdes-Scantling were lined up as the starters on day 1
The Green Bay Packers never lost a football game.
They just ran out of time.
-Vince Lombardi

Offline dannobanano

  • HOF Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 5133
  • Karma: +38/-2
Re: Position look: WR
« Reply #17 on: May 22, 2019, 01:44:45 PM »
I imagine several WR's were a part of this group.

https://www.packers.com/news/blake-martinez-is-a-football-junkie

[Special teams coordinator Shawn Mennenga:
(on the return game)
"We’re trying a whole host of guys. We’re giving everybody an opportunity who’s done it. This is really the first opportunity they’ve had to catch a ball off JUGS and off a foot. We’re throwing a lot of guys back there and evaluating a whole bunch of guys."]


Would be interesting to know who all the participants were and who looked natural, and who didn't.

Offline dannobanano

  • HOF Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 5133
  • Karma: +38/-2
Re: Position look: WR
« Reply #18 on: May 24, 2019, 12:38:05 PM »
#1) All receivers (WR and TE) are expected to learn the formations first.
#2) All receivers are then expected to learn the route tree off of each formation.

A couple examples of what to expect:

https://cheeseheadtv.com/blog/film-study-lafleurs-play-action-rollout-419

https://cheeseheadtv.com/blog/film-study-lafleurs-playbook-swing-pass-207


And just a footnote on Trevor Davis.

https://cheeseheadtv.com/blog/no-receivers-seat-is-hotter-than-trevor-davis-711

here's another installation on what to look for in MLF's passing game.

https://cheeseheadtv.com/blog/film-study-lafleurs-playbook-slantflat-138

Offline RT

  • HOF Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3356
  • Karma: +57/-17
Re: Position look: WR
« Reply #19 on: May 30, 2019, 02:04:30 PM »
From Ryan Wood.

WR coach Alvis Whitted Jr. believes Davante Adams moving around formation, both perimeter and slot, will only enhance problems he gives to a defense. And you already know what he can do: "He's the leader in our room. He's the alpha. A lot of guys look to him."

Whitted on J'Mon Moore rebounding from last year: "I'd have to say it was very humbling for him. It's human nature. You were a higher draft pick, and some of the other guys came in and had success." Whitted says Moore's talent is clear, he sees it, and he expects big things.

Whitted unsolicited praises Trevor Davis: "He's been known as a special teams guy, but he's been actually showing up on tape. And that's what you want. You want guys showing up on tape, and forcing us to make tough decisions."

Offline RT

  • HOF Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3356
  • Karma: +57/-17
Re: Position look: WR
« Reply #20 on: June 05, 2019, 07:00:45 AM »
Again it is way to early to make judgements, but the pecking order of the WR's early on is interesting. Yesterday EQ, MVS, Allison & Kumerow practicing with the starters with Adams out and the next man up after that was Davis. Their is plenty of time for J'Mon Moore to earn a spot in the race for roster spots, but it appears that he might be doing it from the back of the pack.

Rodgers spoke glowingly about Marquez Valdes-Scantling yesterday and Rodgers is also shown a liking to throwing to Allison and Kumerow, add in Adams to that group and the hill could be a little steep for Moore. If Rodgers won't throw the ball to Moore it could be the death nail. Davis with his return ability and flashing big catches like he did yesterday (which he does every year with no pads on) will also be in the mix for a roster spot.

I am personally hoping Moore can turn it around in the preseason, but at the end of the day the numbers crunching might not be kind to Moore.     

Offline craig

  • HOF Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3768
  • Karma: +21/-4
Re: Position look: WR
« Reply #21 on: June 05, 2019, 07:44:44 AM »
Thanks, RT, those are good thoughts.  Obviously there is a long ways to go and lots of time for performance and injuries to reshuffle the ladder. 

Several thoughts:
1.  Rodgers may not be the most natural or instinctive of "leaders", but I think he wants to be.  I think he sometimes says stuff with the intention of encouraging or motivating or challenging or whatever.  I'm glad he chose to take the encourage-and-praise approach with MVS. 
2.  Moore being 7th on the depth chart is interesting, albeit not surprising.  He was behind MVS-ESB-Allison-Kumerow last year, so it would stand to reason that he'd begin behind them again this year.  For most teams, even with coaching turnover, the ladder for a new season matches the ladder from the previous season.  The burden-of-proof is on the lower guy to pass somebody.  (Nowhere is this more numbered and quantified then on a tennis team; there is a direct challenge system, so if #7 wants to move up, periodic opportunities are allowed for him to "challenge" #6, and the winner come out #6, the loser #7.  Having a 1-on-1 competition with a clearly defined winner is unfortunately not so easily conducted in a team sport like football....)
3.  It stands to reason that if Moore started at #7, he'd fall further behind at first.  I don't think he's as mentally, diagnostically, and classroom quick as the guys ahead of him.  So I'd kinda guess that adjusting to the new formations and expectations of a new coaching staff might take him variably longer to master than many (all?) of the guys ahead of him.  ESB is really smart; Davis's field sense hasn't been necessarily great, but classroom-wise he's very smart; Kumerow is pretty smart.   So I'd almost kinda guess that during the adjustment period, that Moore might fall a little further behind before he maybe will start to catch back up? 
4.  How much ST action did Moore play when he was active last season?  Even if neither his performance nor injury were to jump him up to #6, might he still make it as a #7 guy if they can use him regularly on ST? 
5.  RT, you note that Davis has gotten mentioned in OTA's past, without that necessarily translating into pads. That's a good reminder.  That said, Davis has gotten a number of favorable comments, it's seemed.  IN your 2nd previous post form last week, you noted that Whitted had shared some unsolicited praise for him.  Then again in yesterday's report.  It would really be cool if he emerged as a good, capable situational-package guy.  Obviously if he can get free the only receiver who can run straight-line with him is MVS; I could imagine some plays where they might want his vertical speed, or perhaps his slant/crossing speed.  But he's also a smaller, quicker change-of-direction guy than most of the longer guys, so it's possible that he might find some niche plays in slot.  Being so different from the other 6 guys, it's possible that might be a disadvantage ("doesn't fit what the Packers want in a WR"), but it might be an advantage (MLF repeats a basketball analogy, you may not want all forwards, having one quicker little point guard might be a good fit?)  Given that he's the obvious guy for returns, **IF** he can make the team, it would be fun if he could justify himself and have a niche in the WR room; if he could legit make the team just as a WR, and the usage as return guy is frosting, not the cake itself....
6.  Moore is certainly eligible for PS.  Every other team in the league has interesting fast WR prospects in camp; *IF* Moore can't show enough to win a spot with the Packers, I'm not sure how many other teams would dump their own promising fast young WR prospect to replace him with Moore? 
7.  Kumerow is an interesting guy too.  Long shot last year, and again this year at 27 we all talk more about the 3 drafted sophomores than him.  But it sounds like he's doing well again.  He may well make the team again, deserve to do so, and be capable when called upon.  I wonder if he might not have a good aptitude for the system?  Seems like he may be kind of an instinctive guy with a good feel for soft spots and stuff.  Those skills may play well in the MLF system? 
8.  Off-season, I kind of envisioned ESB as my favorite to make a big step, and perhaps the most likely to emerge as a capable #2 guy.  Don't recall anything negative said about him, but if anything the OTA talk hasn't said much about him at all.  Not Whitted buzzing him up, not Rodgers buzzing him up, not media reports of big or deep catches.  Small sample size, so who knows.  But he's not seemed to command a lot of attention thus far. 

Offline RT

  • HOF Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3356
  • Karma: +57/-17
Re: Position look: WR
« Reply #22 on: June 06, 2019, 07:43:22 AM »
Is their an Allstate commercial in his future?


PFF GB Packers


 
@PFF_Packers

 
More
Among rookie WR's last season, Equanimeous St. Brown led the draft class with the most targets (34) without having a drop.

Offline B

  • HOF Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4257
  • Karma: +15/-8
Re: Position look: WR
« Reply #23 on: June 10, 2019, 06:39:00 AM »
From S.I. 10 things by Albert Breer:

8. Name to watch in Green Bay going into minicamp, and training camp:

Second-year receiver Marquez Valdes-Scantling. The 6' 4", 206-pound 24-year-old is faster than the new staff anticipated he’d be, and has quickly picked up Matt LaFleur’s system, which is significantly different than Mike McCarthy’s. You know how big Aaron Rodgers’s arm is, and the Packers quarterback hasn’t been able to overthrow him in OTAs.

Add Valdes-Scantling’s emergence to Jimmy Graham surprising the staff with his still-there movement skills, and it looks like Green Bay is going to have ways to take the pressure off No. 1 receiver Davante Adams.
« Last Edit: June 10, 2019, 06:45:01 AM by B »
The Green Bay Packers never lost a football game.
They just ran out of time.
-Vince Lombardi

Offline Hands

  • HOF Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1528
  • Karma: +5/-0
    • Uncover
Re: Position look: WR
« Reply #24 on: June 10, 2019, 07:02:19 AM »
I really think Green Bay has a solid corp of WRs. I don't think Moore will be part of it. I think he has the ability, but not sure he has the "want to" that it takes to make it happen.
In the land of the blind.....the one eye man is king!

Offline RT

  • HOF Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3356
  • Karma: +57/-17
Re: Position look: WR
« Reply #25 on: June 10, 2019, 07:52:16 AM »
I really think Green Bay has a solid corp of WRs. I don't think Moore will be part of it. I think he has the ability, but not sure he has the "want to" that it takes to make it happen.

I am very curious to see how the Moore thing plays out. The Packers knew how raw Moore was when they drafted him and it was going to probably take a couple of years for him to put it all together, but he has some rare qualities that GM's do not easily give up on. Their are parallels here of Trevor Davis, both special athletes who come from college systems that did nothing to prepare them for life in the NFL. In the pre-draft process scouts often warned that it would take time for both of these players to be productive at the NFL level and the Packers understand that completely. As for fans they repeat all the catch phases after the draft like they understand, but most don't understand. When it doesn't happen in the first season they are gathering their pitchforks to run the bums out of town.

Hands, I don't know if Moore has the "want to" or not, but if you checkout what he has put himself though this off season to make himself better I am not sure how you would come to that conclusion.         

Offline Hands

  • HOF Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1528
  • Karma: +5/-0
    • Uncover
Re: Position look: WR
« Reply #26 on: June 10, 2019, 08:24:51 AM »
I really think Green Bay has a solid corp of WRs. I don't think Moore will be part of it. I think he has the ability, but not sure he has the "want to" that it takes to make it happen.

I am very curious to see how the Moore thing plays out. The Packers knew how raw Moore was when they drafted him and it was going to probably take a couple of years for him to put it all together, but he has some rare qualities that GM's do not easily give up on. Their are parallels here of Trevor Davis, both special athletes who come from college systems that did nothing to prepare them for life in the NFL. In the pre-draft process scouts often warned that it would take time for both of these players to be productive at the NFL level and the Packers understand that completely. As for fans they repeat all the catch phases after the draft like they understand, but most don't understand. When it doesn't happen in the first season they are gathering their pitchforks to run the bums out of town.

Hands, I don't know if Moore has the "want to" or not, but if you checkout what he has put himself though this off season to make himself better I am not sure how you would come to that conclusion.         

RT, I read all his self-examination stories and was impressed with his accountability. It's what I've read about his OTAs performance isn't that great. In particular drop passes. I understand his lack of route awareness and nuances, but if the ball get's into his catch radius...not sure why he can't catch it. Granted, I didn't see it for myself, again only what I read. The problem isn't his status and potential as a pro receiver, but his team competition with fellow receivers. The Packers will only carry so many receivers. He is also competing for a roster spot with the top 53 players. If he's not on any special team units ...how will he make the team? This doesn't mean I'm hoping he fails, far from it, I thought he was a solid prospect. I think that the Packer's WR depth will make it hard for them to wait for him. Similar situation as MT. Adams. He has mad skills, but has to turn it on in order to make the team. Let's face it...nobody makes the team during OTAs. It's just an observation.
In the land of the blind.....the one eye man is king!

Offline RT

  • HOF Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3356
  • Karma: +57/-17
Re: Position look: WR
« Reply #27 on: June 11, 2019, 01:19:45 PM »
Jason B. Hirschhorn

Follow @by_JBH
 

Matt LaFleur continues to praise Trevor Davis. If Davis has indeed improved entering his fourth season, he looks well positioned to win a roster spot. The Packers don't have many established returners, but he's one of them.


Ryan Wood

Follow @ByRyanWood
 
LaFleur has more praise for Trevor Davis. Seems he’s had a really nice offseason and has positioned himself to have a big camp.



Michael Cohen

Follow @Michael_Cohen13
 
LaFleur is echoing the praise we’ve heard from assistant coaches and players regarding Trevor Davis. He says Davis has made plays all spring and improved his work ethic along the way. Sure sounds like Davis is in a good position to contend for a roster spot.

Seems to be a theme here.
« Last Edit: June 11, 2019, 01:23:06 PM by RT »

Offline craig

  • HOF Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3768
  • Karma: +21/-4
Re: Position look: WR
« Reply #28 on: June 11, 2019, 02:03:05 PM »
Seems to be a theme, for sure.  IN that MLF and Whitten (?) have mentioned him favorably. 

Heh heh, when all media people attend the same news conference, of course, there's a natural thing that they all will have a common theme in repeating the thing said at the conference. 

Offline RT

  • HOF Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3356
  • Karma: +57/-17
Re: Position look: WR
« Reply #29 on: June 11, 2019, 03:08:53 PM »
Seems to be a theme, for sure.  IN that MLF and Whitten (?) have mentioned him favorably. 

Heh heh, when all media people attend the same news conference, of course, there's a natural thing that they all will have a common theme in repeating the thing said at the conference.

Hey, you are exposing my tongue-in-cheek fun here.