September 14, 2019, 10:48:40 PM

Author Topic: The 53 Game  (Read 3862 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline dannobanano

  • HOF Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 5279
  • Karma: +43/-2
Re: The 53 Game
« Reply #30 on: August 21, 2019, 06:56:33 AM »
Evidently Sternberger is still in concussion protocol.

His participation yesterday was part of his protocol from what I heard.

He has still not been cleared.

From Cheeseheadtv:

Jace Sternberger is actually not out of concussion protocol just yet. Today was only part of the protocol. Still needs to respond positively to physical exertion.
« Last Edit: August 21, 2019, 06:58:09 AM by dannobanano »

Offline RT

  • HOF Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3529
  • Karma: +60/-17
Re: The 53 Game
« Reply #31 on: August 21, 2019, 07:20:36 AM »
There are 8 game-day-inactives every week.  No problem stashing red-shirts there. 

The notion that either Lazard or Shepherd will get picked up seems remote to me.  Both seem like nice PS candidates to me. 

RT, I don't see carrying 10 OL.  Only 7 game-day-active anyway.  Not sure we want to use 3 of the game-day-inactives on depth-linemen, especially for ones who aren't develpmental prospects.

I had to go back and check my memory craig about the number of OL carried on the opening day roster. Last year was like most years with 9, 2010 was only 8. 2017 originally had 10, but Barclay was placed on IR after the fact I believe. Rosters have always been heavy one place and light in others for the last 15 years and I don't think that is changing under Gutes. I agree that 10 OL is a large number and a little bit of outside the box thinking, but after keeping 9 last season and having an even deeper OL talent pool this season it would not surprise me if it happened that way. Will it? Probably not, but not out of the question. 10 OL is probably as likely as 7 WR. IMO.

Offline OneTwoSixFive

  • HOF Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2391
  • Karma: +16/-10
Re: The 53 Game
« Reply #32 on: August 21, 2019, 01:59:06 PM »
..........or maybe two fullbacks this year, who knows.
(ricky) "Personally, I'm putting this in a box, driving a stake through its heart, firing a silver bullet into its (empty) head, nailing it shut, loading it into a rocket and firing it into the sun. "

(Pink Floyd) "Set the controls for the heart of the sun"

Offline big ror

  • HOF Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 772
  • Karma: +4/-0
Re: The 53 Game
« Reply #33 on: August 21, 2019, 02:32:12 PM »
There are 8 game-day-inactives every week.  No problem stashing red-shirts there. 

The notion that either Lazard or Shepherd will get picked up seems remote to me.  Both seem like nice PS candidates to me. 

RT, I don't see carrying 10 OL.  Only 7 game-day-active anyway.  Not sure we want to use 3 of the game-day-inactives on depth-linemen, especially for ones who aren't develpmental prospects.

I agree re: Lazard and Shepard. Every year, we hear someone claim confidently that [insert fringe receiver] won't clear waivers--and then he miraculously does. Right now, I think Shepard and Davis are fighting for the final spot, and these last two games will go a long way to determining who gets it. And part of that battle will be won through special teams performance.

As for the OL, if they only have seven active on game days, which has been the case more often than not, who might those be? My guess is that Jenkins (if he doesn't earn the starting job) is one, as he can play anywhere along the interior (speaking of: has he been taking snaps at center? I know Madison has been). Who would be the other--Light? He's the only other one who is working extensively at tackle. I think Turner would be the first to move to RT, but who would replace Bak if that nightmare scenario occurred?

..........or maybe two fullbacks this year, who knows.

Oof. I'd really hate to allocate two people to that position despite how much the fullback looks to factor into the offense. My guess is that they have a fullback on the practice squad.
"cram it up your cramhole, lafleur."

Offline dannobanano

  • HOF Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 5279
  • Karma: +43/-2
Re: The 53 Game
« Reply #34 on: August 21, 2019, 06:37:13 PM »
A lot will be determined in these final two preseason games, but as of today the only two WR spots that are currently locks are Adams and MVS. (JMHO)

After those two, who they end up keeping will really depend on how many spots they want to allocate to the WR position, and how Allison, TD-Jesus, ESB, Davis, Shepherd, and Lazard all perform in both the final 2 preseason games and practice for the next 9 days.

If it's only 5, then Shepherd and Lazard may not be in the conversation.

But if it's 6 or 7, then either or both could very well be in the conversation.

Offline OneTwoSixFive

  • HOF Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2391
  • Karma: +16/-10
Re: The 53 Game
« Reply #35 on: August 22, 2019, 10:29:22 AM »
[quote author=dannobanano link=topic=7847.msg195975#msg195975 date=1566437833
If it's only 5, then Shepherd and Lazard may not be in the conversation.

But if it's 6 or 7, then either or both could very well be in the conversation.[/quote][/color]

Only keeping five receivers likely means Adams, MVS, Allison, Kumerow, Davis.
That would mean losing ESB and Moore, as well as Lazard and Shepherd. I just have difficulty believing the Packers expose that much talent to be snapped up by other teams. I'm pretty convinced it is 6 or 7 receivers this year. The 6th is probably ESB. Seventh is (for me) Shepherd, as he is a good backup to Allison in the slot, and for Davis on ST. Lazard looks set to hit the PS, maybe Moore as well, to give him more time to see if he figures things out. It won't be long (31 August, just 9 days away) before the Turk takes his walk of death, to fringe roster prospects.
« Last Edit: August 22, 2019, 11:06:46 AM by OneTwoSixFive »
(ricky) "Personally, I'm putting this in a box, driving a stake through its heart, firing a silver bullet into its (empty) head, nailing it shut, loading it into a rocket and firing it into the sun. "

(Pink Floyd) "Set the controls for the heart of the sun"

Offline big ror

  • HOF Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 772
  • Karma: +4/-0
Re: The 53 Game
« Reply #36 on: August 23, 2019, 11:43:31 AM »
the before the third pre-season game edition~!

Offense (26):

QB:  Rodgers, Kizer, Boyle
RB:  Jones, J. Williams, D. Williams
FB:  Vitale
WR:  Adams, MVS, Allison, Kumerow, St. Brown, Davis
TE:  Graham, Lewis, Tonyan, Sternberger
OL:  Bakhtiari, Taylor, Linsley, Turner, Bulaga, Jenkins, Light, Madison, Patrick

---

Defense (24):

DL:  Clark, Lowry, Adams, Keke, Lancaster
OLB:  Z. Smith, P. Smith, Gary, Fackrell
ILB:  Martinez, Burks, Bolton, Summers
CB:  Alexander, King, T. Williams, Brown, Jackson, Holloman
S:  Savage, Amos, Greene, Jones, Campbell

---

Special Teams (3):
K:  Crosby
P:  Scott
LS:  Bradley

---

Practice Squad:  Shepard (WR), Lazard (WR), Nijman (OL), Looney (DL), Sullivan (CB), Ento (CB), Jamerson (S), Brown (DL), some FB, some RB

---

Thoughts:
  • I've seen a lot of people predict that the Packers will only keep two QBs--Rodgers and Kizer--but given Rodgers' injury history the last few seasons, that seems like a very risky proposition, especially since Kizer hasn't shown much improvement during his tenure. I guess the Packers could always try to sneak Boyle onto the practice squad; I doubt he'd have the appeal of, say, a Taysum Hill. Ideally, the Packers would go and get a vet at QB (I've said they should have signed Kaep for the past few seasons), but my guess is that Gutey goes with all three or with Kizer with the hopes of stashing Boyle.
  • WR is once again the most intriguing position in training camp. Adams, MVS, Allison, and Kumerow feel like the only locks at this stage. After that, I have no clue what will happen. I really like St. Brown's potential, and per the beat, Davis finally looks like he can contribute on offense and not just on special teams. Shepard and Lizard have played really well, both in practice and in pre-season games, and each offers something different and desirable: Shepard is the only true slot receiver, and he's flashed on special teams, which could make Davis expendable; Lizard has great size. It'll be really interesting to see how this shakes out. I will say that I don't see any place for Moore despite all of the other exciting attributes he possesses: the guy just can't catch the ball consistently.
  • I'm not entirely confident with my TE selections. Graham and Tonyan are locks, but Lewis could get cut if Tonyan proves he can be a worthy blocker. Sternberger continues to miss time, and while I suspect he'll return soon, he might end up on IR for a redshirt year.
  • The back end of the OL will be interesting. I think there's a slight chance Taylor is cut if Jenkins earns the starting job, but I'd be against such a move, as it doesn't take much to imagine a scenario in which Bulaga gets hurt, Turner kicks out to RT, and Jenkins jumps in at RG. Ultimately, I think Madison, McCray, and Patrick (and maybe Pankey) are battling for the final two spots. Madison has the most upside, and of those guys, he seems the most likely to get claimed on waivers. McCray is more versatile than Patrick, and as such, he's getting the nod in a lot of roster mocks. I think Patrick is the better player, however, so I went with him.
  • I initially had Gilbert on the 53, but I ended up cutting him, which is to say: I think there's a chance he still makes this team. Going with only four OLBs in a 3-4, especially when two of them (Z. Smith and Gary) can kick inside, might be insufficient.
  • At ILB, the only two I feel confident will be on the 53 to start the season are Martinez and Bolton. While I'm pleased that Burks' injury might not be season ending, it might land him on the IR nonetheless if they think he won't be ready until the second-ish half of the season. Summers is an interesting prospect with incredible athleticism, but he sure forgets to wrap up and thus misses a lot of tackles. If Burks is on IR, I could see Crawford making the team--and he might regardless ahead of Summers given the former's special teams aptitude.
  • S could result in a few different configurations. I have Jones making the team, but he's still...sick? I wouldn't be surprised if he's traded before the season starts, as others have suggested. I sure would like to see him get a chance as an ILB or a box nickel safety, though. Like many, I have fond memories of his game against the Bengals from his rookie year. Campbell is also a question mark. I assume he's going to be on the team eventually, and Pettine really likes him, but as of now, he still hasn't returned from the torn ACL.
  • I'm not sure if everyone I've projected onto the practice squad is actually eligible. I reserved the last two spots for a fullback and a running back; it seems likely they'll have one of each on the PS given the style of offense LaFleur wants to run coupled with the collective health concerns for the players they currently have in those positions.

After last night's "game," a few things worth noting:
  • Davis is going to make this team, especially now that St. Brown has an injury that might place him on IR. I'm starting to think they'll keep 6, which means Shepard will probably make the team too.
  • Tre Carson continues to get snaps ahead of Dexter Williams--and deservingly so. I don't think they'll cut Williams, despite his struggles catching the ball out of the backfield: after all, he's a draft pick, and he's shown impressive flashes. Do they keep four running backs and five backs total? With Jones's injury history, it might be a prudent move.
  • Bakhtiari, Jenkins, Linsley, Turner, Bulaga, and Light are locks. I think there's an outside chance Taylor gets cut. I don't think they'll keep Madison, McCray, and Patrick, but I don't know who will be the odd man out. Madison sure seemed to struggle last night.
  • Does Summers know he has arms? Yeesh. Crawford should be ahead of him, and probably is. With Bolton's injury, both might make the team, but I could also see Gute signing a guy off the streets (e.g., Foster).
  • It's looking more and more likely that Josh Jones isn't going to stay on this team, which is unfortunate, as the Packers could really use him at ILB now that both Burks and Bolton are hurt.
  • Sullivan continues to impress me. Am I alone in this regard? Is he eligible for the PS?
  • The Packers should keep both Kizer and Boyle.
"cram it up your cramhole, lafleur."

Offline OneTwoSixFive

  • HOF Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2391
  • Karma: +16/-10
Re: The 53 Game
« Reply #37 on: August 23, 2019, 03:15:05 PM »
After last night's "game," a few things worth noting:
  • Davis is going to make this team, especially now that St. Brown has an injury that might place him on IR. I'm starting to think they'll keep 6, which means Shepard will probably make the team too.
  • Tre Carson continues to get snaps ahead of Dexter Williams--and deservingly so. I don't think they'll cut Williams, despite his struggles catching the ball out of the backfield: after all, he's a draft pick, and he's shown impressive flashes. Do they keep four running backs and five backs total? With Jones's injury history, it might be a prudent move.
  • Bakhtiari, Jenkins, Linsley, Turner, Bulaga, and Light are locks. I think there's an outside chance Taylor gets cut. I don't think they'll keep Madison, McCray, and Patrick, but I don't know who will be the odd man out. Madison sure seemed to struggle last night.
  • Does Summers know he has arms? Yeesh. Crawford should be ahead of him, and probably is. With Bolton's injury, both might make the team, but I could also see Gute signing a guy off the streets (e.g., Foster).
  • It's looking more and more likely that Josh Jones isn't going to stay on this team, which is unfortunate, as the Packers could really use him at ILB now that both Burks and Bolton are hurt.
  • Sullivan continues to impress me. Am I alone in this regard? Is he eligible for the PS?
  • The Packers should keep both Kizer and Boyle.

OL Taylor is is on the team. Bakhtiari, Taylor, Linsley, Turner, Bulaga, Jenkins, Light, Patrick, they will all make it (that's 8). A ninth could be one of several, my money is on McCray.
I'm guessing 3 RBs, Jones, J.Williams, D.Williams. Dexter annoys coaches but has more talent than Tra Carson. If there is a 4th RB, my bet is he is probably from another team, though Ford might have an outside chance.
Agree that Josh Jones extended 'illness' suggests he is gone.
My WR take is that either the Packers go 7 WRs and keep Shepherd, or he (or in fact any back-of-the-roster guy) is cut to allow ESB to make the team and go on IR, then re-signed, so after the moves it is Adams/MVS/Allison/Kumerow/Davis/Shepherd (6)
Agree Davis makes the team. When you have a 5th receiver who looks pretty decent (this year), and has a high ST value (PR, gunner) you keep him.
Because of the level of talent elsewhere on the team (and lack of it at backup QB), I'm guessing only 2 x QBs on the roster, with the Packers picking another up from the street if needed. The no.2 QB is Boyle.
« Last Edit: August 23, 2019, 03:18:54 PM by OneTwoSixFive »
(ricky) "Personally, I'm putting this in a box, driving a stake through its heart, firing a silver bullet into its (empty) head, nailing it shut, loading it into a rocket and firing it into the sun. "

(Pink Floyd) "Set the controls for the heart of the sun"

Offline mancl

  • HOF Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 776
  • Karma: +8/-1
Re: The 53 Game
« Reply #38 on: August 23, 2019, 03:25:12 PM »
ESB looks to be out for about 6 weeks.  That is good news for him but it makes putting together a roster more difficult.  Adams, MVS, Allison and Kumerow are locks.  Davis is probable.  I can't see them keeping 7 receivers so it comes down to ESB or Shep IMHO.

I like Sullivan too and would like to figure out a way to keep him.  He's young, can play any position in the secondary and has shown himself to be a playmaker.  Someone will pick him up if  the Packers don't find a spot for him.

Madison Patrick,Mc Cray and Pankey are competing for 2 spots.   Mc Cray and Patrick have topped out.  We don't know ceiling for Madison or Pankey.

I think Madison can make it to the PS.  Pankey plays tackle which is harder to find than an inside player so I would keep him.  Probably go with Mc Cray because he can play more positions.

I like Wilkins and will put him on the PS

But let's be honest- the success of the Packer season or long term future doesn't depend upon the players we are discussing.

Offline dannobanano

  • HOF Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 5279
  • Karma: +43/-2
Re: The 53 Game
« Reply #39 on: August 23, 2019, 06:23:13 PM »
I'd like to see them find a way to keep Lazard as well, even if it means shorting another position group for a day or so while they clear ESB onto IR, which they might also do with Sternberger who still hasn't cleared concussion protocol. If they feel they just can't keep that many WR's on the 53, then cut Lazard after teams have established their rosters and PS's (it improves his chances by waiting), and then sign him to the PS. Would be nice having a WR like him waiting in the wings in case injuries happen. Teo Redding would be a good one to try and get on PS as well.

Sternberger is/was going to be nothing more than a "Flex" (receiving) TE this year, and the emergence of Tonyan as a "move" (blocking/receiving) TE might mean they could afford to give Sternberger a redshirt year.

If the Packers feel they need injury insurance by putting Sternberger on IR, then they could stash Baylis on the PS.

Offline dannobanano

  • HOF Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 5279
  • Karma: +43/-2
Re: The 53 Game
« Reply #40 on: August 24, 2019, 08:29:14 AM »
I'm on the fence regarding Dexter Williams making the final 53.

If there's been one player on this team that has looked overwhelmed by the big stage this TC and pre-season, it's been Dexter.

His running style is a perfect fit for this new offense, but he continues to make mistakes.

Missed blocks/blitz pick up.
Dropped passes.
Mental errors.
Etc.

While Ford and Hall do not possess the running talent of Williams. They have made far less mistakes.

Can Williams become a more assignment sure player by the start of the regular season?

Or, does it make sense for Gute to sign another RB after cutdowns, or even make a trade deal for a RB prior to the regular season?

I had high hopes for Williams following the draft. But right now his unreliability worries me.

Offline RT

  • HOF Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3529
  • Karma: +60/-17
Re: The 53 Game
« Reply #41 on: August 24, 2019, 10:08:21 AM »
A month ago I would of given little thought to a rumor of trading Lane Taylor and starting the season with Jenkins at LG, but I believe there is a fair chance of that happening now. Some will think that their is no market for Taylor, but with a cheap and controlled contract for the next 2 seasons I believe he has trade value. The shortage of OL talent affects a number of teams and a starting OG should be appealing to several teams beginning with the Ravens. 

https://www.baltimorebeatdown.com/2019/8/21/20812757/what-will-the-baltimore-ravens-do-at-left-guard-james-hurst-jermaine-eluemunor-ben-powers

Offline OneTwoSixFive

  • HOF Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2391
  • Karma: +16/-10
Re: The 53 Game
« Reply #42 on: August 24, 2019, 12:28:20 PM »
The value of Taylor is this. With him starting at LG (for now), Elgton Jenkins and Billy Turner can between them cover four of the five positions on the O line if there is an injury. As the sixth man in, Jenkins, has enough ability that a line with him in it is still pretty good. Light covers LT now that Spriggs is gone.

Since you can almost guarantee an O line injury in the season, I really like that the first injury is probably easily covered (ok, it's tougher if LT goes down). I'd take that over any savings the Packers might make by letting Taylor go, especially as Taylor is healthy this year, unlike most of last year. Given the importance of keeping our 35 year old QB healthy, I'd keep Taylor all day, every day.
(ricky) "Personally, I'm putting this in a box, driving a stake through its heart, firing a silver bullet into its (empty) head, nailing it shut, loading it into a rocket and firing it into the sun. "

(Pink Floyd) "Set the controls for the heart of the sun"

Offline mancl

  • HOF Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 776
  • Karma: +8/-1
Re: The 53 Game
« Reply #43 on: August 24, 2019, 05:12:23 PM »
I'll take a different twist at this roster game as I project the players I see on the initial 10 player practice squad.

QB Wilkins- has lots  of swagger and a good arm- Kizer is released

RB D Williams- they are looking to trade for a RB according to ESPN

wr Moore- the kid has talent but his confidence must be shot

OT Nijman- the practice squad is made for players like this- talented but raw

OG has a future but needs to shake off rust

Corner  Ento- see Nijman

Ramsey- very athletic but needs to put on weight- dark horse to make the 53 if they want this ability on ST over Gilber

Sheldon- has shown some potential and ILB is a weak position

DE Looney

NT- Sagapolu- probably not 100% after injury- worth seeing what they have

---

Roberts will be waived injured but they guaranteed part of his salary- something Ball doesn't do- until now. They will bring him back at some point to see what they havve

Online craig

  • HOF Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3912
  • Karma: +22/-4
Re: The 53 Game
« Reply #44 on: August 24, 2019, 06:16:48 PM »
I like your thnking there, manci.  "OG":  you're talking Madison, I assume? 

I'd probably leave Sagapolu off; I'd kinda like to keep Shepherd instead?  I'd think it might be OK to keep two WR on PS.  I think it's OK to keep an extra offensive player on PS, because I think a lot of game-planning is preparing the defense for the opponent's offense.